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The Coil Sprung (Land-Rover) Owner List Daily Digest
Send Submissions uk-lro@Land-Rover.Team.Net
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Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1996 08:32:58 -0500 (CDT)
From: "David C. McCormack" <dmccorma@execpc.com>
Subject: Re: Tow Hooks
When I had my winch mount made I had loops welded to it. The welder
used 3/4 inch steel bar, bent in a U shape and welded at each end to the
winch mount. I now have two tow points, one on either side of the roller
fairlead (handy for hooking the winch line to when not in use). One note of
caution, if using a pulley to double line while winching, I will not attach
the winch line back to one of the tow loops because I will then be almost
doubling the load on the winch mount. Which means I will need to find
another anchor like a tree and distribute the load that way or find another
place to hook to on the vehicle. WOULD IT BE NUTS TO HAVE A WELDER WELD A
PAIR OF HOOKS DIRECTLY TO THE FRAME??
At 03:36 PM 4/17/96 -0700, John Brabyn wrote:
>good sturdy recovery hooks on the front. . . .
>Does anyone know of a solution (other than the $50 recovery loops
[ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>mounts etc, and the vehicle handbook specifically forbids us from using
>the factory towing loop for vehicle recovery.
David C. McCormack
95 White Discovery, Wisconsin, "MackX4"
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From: lenagham@inetmail.bachman.com
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 96 11:39:13 EST
Subject: Re: Temperature sensors.
Hugh,
the following comments are based on the assumption that by 1989 the US
spec Range Rovers and UK spec RRs were similar. (Earlier ones were
not). The US spec Range Rovers also have 3 sensors.
1. Temp sensor for ECU EAC3927L (may be superseded by ETC8496)
this sensor is located to the right of the thermostat housing. It is
mounted with the connector facing upwards and has 2 wires as part of
the connection.
2. The temp transmiiter sensor for the temp gauge is either
PRC 6317 for the 3.5 engine
PRC 7918 for the 3.9 engine
this sensor is located to the left and slightly below (I think) the
thermostat housing. It only has a single connection to it.
3. The sensor (actually temp activated switch) for the A/C fan is part
# PRC3505 and is located in the thermostat housing itself. This sounds
different to your setup.
My parts manual is a couple of years old so some of these part numbers
may have been changed.
The sensor that would be causing your problems is #1 above. The
workshop manual does have some details on the resistance measured
across the terminals of this sensor at various temperatures - I don't
have them at the moment but will bring them to work from home, unless
someone else can oblige.
This sensor is not a "timer" - when it reaches a certain temp the
resistance as sensed by the ECU will cause the ECU to go into warm
running mode.
There are some sensors that are referred to as thermotime sensors that
were used in Range Rovers in the UK - these were never used in the US
models. Unfortunately I don't remember what these sensors were
controlling or whether they were still in use in 1989.
Hope this helps, rather than just adding to the confusion.
Regards
Mike Lenaghan
> Subject: Temperature sensors.
> Author: hdavies@kzin.mon.rnb.com (Hugh J.E. Davies) at inetmail
[ truncated by lro-digester (was 36 lines)]
> This is *NOT* an official publication of RNB.
> Personal email to huge@axalotl.demon.co.uk, please.
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Date: Thu, 18 Apr 96 12:23:39 -0400
From: "barnett childress" <barnett=childress%Eng%EMCHOP1@fishbowl02.lss.emc.com>
Subject: test
Hi all,
only a test of new Beyond Mail.
Cheers,
Barnett
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From: Lodelane@aol.com
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1996 14:08:22 -0400
Subject: unsubscribe
unscribe rro
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Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1996 11:36:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Brabyn <brabyn@skivs.ski.org>
Subject: Re: Temperature sensors.
> 2. The temp transmiiter sensor for the temp gauge is either
> PRC 6317 for the 3.5 engine
> PRC 7918 for the 3.9 engine
Note: early 89's used the PRC6317 even though they had the 3.9 engine.
Cheers
John Brabyn
89RR
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Subject: Re: Speedo issues revisited
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1996 16:00:27 -0400
From: William Caloccia <caloccia@OpenMarket.com>
>From reading the 'allowable' specs before servicing a speedometer for
Fords and checking with my speedo repair man, my information is that it
is common to accept a reading which upto 4 mph above the actual speed,
0 below it, at 60mph. (a 6.67% error) (On reason why the police don't want
to believe that your speedometer reads below the actual speed you were
travelling.)
As you may know a mechanical speedometer is a spinning magnet on the end of
the speedo cable, placed in an aluminium cup. The spinning magnetic field
*induces* the cup to spin, but the cup is held back by a spring, thus the cup
rotates in some manner proportional to the speed of the magnet and the
resistance of the spring.
Generally, the speedo is considered true, if it is linear, if it is not true,
then the cup can be weighted, if it is then linear, but over the
correct speed, then the magnet can be slightly demagnitized...to bring it down
to the correct speed. (The latter is an operation that the old speedo guy
didn't like to do, if you remove too much magnetism, then you're screwed.)
Of course you could muck with the spring, but that's considered pretty evil
also.
Cheers,
--bill caloccia@OpenMarket.com
http://www.OpenMarket.com/personal/caloccia/
http://www.Land-Rover.Team.Net/~majordom/lr/
R 1 3 2wd H D
+--|--| o | L 3 Land Rovers First
2 4 4wd L | 2 because
'63 SIIa RHD 88" H 1 Land Rovers Last
793-PTA '90 RR County
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From: KKelly6788@aol.com
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1996 18:14:37 -0400
Subject: Roof Racks
>I too am in need of a roof rack for my 90 RR. the problem is I want the
>best of both worlds. I want the capacity, flexibility, and durability of
[ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>I want the convenient method of carrying bicycles and kayaks that a Thule
>or Yakima rack provides.
I have been a Yakima owner for over 10 years, and I can't say enough about
the racks. (last summer I had over 600lbs. of lumber on the Yakima's on the
roof of my BMW). My friend with a Suburban has a great roof rack set up (I
an going to get the same thing soon) He has four Yakima crossbars with a big
"basket style" rack on top of it he bought it at The Sports Rack U.S.A. the
number in N. California is 415-591-9200 and 415-599-9011, the card also has a
800-RACK-USA phone # I don't know how many locations they have. The rack
looks almost exaxtly the same as the "safari racks" that are in the new
Atlantic British catalog (sport rack sold them for less than AB). There are
many places to buy Yakima’s for less, but this is where he got the big
basket. The basket has no real bottom but he puts in a piece of plywood. It
is strong enough for us to walk around or sleep on it. He keeps it on all
the time and just takes the wood out unless he has a load. All the Yakima
accessories still work and he puts the bikes, skis, snowboards, sailboards
etc. inside the basket.
Kevin Kelly
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From: KKelly6788@aol.com
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1996 18:14:52 -0400
Subject: U.S. Spec Range Rover FAQ Repost
I just got the RRO/CSO list today after not getting it for three days, I
posted this a couple days ago but I am not sure if it made it to the list. I
really appreciate any feedback both positive and negative to make the next
version better.
The FAQ I wrote with year by year changes to the U.S. spec. Range Rover is
now on the Rover Web:
http://www.ridgecrest.ca.us/RoverWeb/
The URL to go directly to the Range Rover FAQ is:
http://www.ridgecrest.ca.us/OVLR/FAQ.4.RangeRover_ClassicUS.html
I want to thank Ben Smith for putting it on the web.
Please let me know if you find any errors or typos (I know there are a few
typos).
I am starting on a Range Rover buyers guide FAQ so if anyone has anything
that may help let me know.
I also plan to eventually do a Range Rover owners guide FAQ.
Kevin Kelly
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Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1996 23:05:40 -0500
From: Jeff & Laura Kessler <lmkessler@srnet.com>
Subject: Re: Testing the load leveler on a RR
At 09:30 AM 4/18/96 MST, you wrote:
>FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov
> Computer Graphics Specialist ~ S.R.P. ~ AM/FM - Graphic Records
[ truncated by lro-digester (was 31 lines)]
>|__|__|__\___ //__/__|__\___ before us are tiny matters compared
>| _| | |_ |} \__/-\_|__/-\_|} to what lies within us."
David,
Here is a message I sent to Kevin Kelly on this a few weeks ago. Maybe I
should of routed a copy to the list back then.
It seems most of us are having some trouble with one or both of the lists or
digests lately.
Here is that message:
Jeff
>At 10:42 AM 4/5/96 -0500, you wrote:
>>In a message dated 96-04-04 22:25:05 EST, you write:
[ truncated by lro-digester (was 13 lines)]
>>Kevin Kelly
>I assumed that if the rear would not "pump" itself up after a few miles on
the road with a heavy load, the Boge leveling unit was bad. Checking my
manual says to load about 990 pounds in the rear and check after a few miles
and the distance to the axle bump stops should be at least 20 mm greater
which does not sound like much.
>The manual say unladen, the distance should be at least 67 mm. If not
>>In a message dated 96-04-04 22:25:05 EST, you write:
check the springs and if after checking or replacing bad springs the
distance is less then 67 mm the Boge unit may need replacing.
>This implys that the Boge unit is used to help support the weight of the RR
>>In a message dated 96-04-04 22:25:05 EST, you write:
instead of acting to just maintain a level ride. This makes sense. The
Boge unit allows "weaker' springs to be used creating a smoother ride in the
rough.
>I have not measured the distance on my RR but it looks level. I had the
>>In a message dated 96-04-04 22:25:05 EST, you write:
springs replaced because it leaned to one side about 2 inches as measured at
the wheel well. I fitted stock shocks. I also fitted Bilstien shocks which
add a little lift.
>Jeff
>>In a message dated 96-04-04 22:25:05 EST, you write:
>>>Also the older Range Rovers would sit lower due to the failure of the Boge
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Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1996 23:35:57 -0500
From: Jeff & Laura Kessler <lmkessler@srnet.com>
Subject: Re: U.S. Spec Range Rover FAQ Repost
At 06:14 PM 4/18/96 -0400, you wrote:
>I just got the RRO/CSO list today after not getting it for three days, I
>posted this a couple days ago but I am not sure if it made it to the list. I
[ truncated by lro-digester (was 28 lines)]
>I also plan to eventually do a Range Rover owners guide FAQ.
>Kevin Kelly
Kevin
Glad to hear you finally got it up and running. I will check it out as soon
as I can.
Thanks for all your hard work on this.
BTW, I did see your earlier posting but I and other have also been having
spotty reception lately.
Jeff
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From: lenagham@inetmail.bachman.com
Date: Fri, 19 Apr 96 09:38:24 EST
Subject: Re: Temperature sensors.
Hugh,
I have some more information for you regarding coolant sensors.
If your engine has a cold start injector and A/C, then it probably has
4 coolant sensors:
1. The coolant sensor for the ECU. This isensor has a semi-conductor
resistor and is also known as a thermistor. Sometimes called a NTC
(Negative Temperature Coefficient) - the sensor's resistance goes down
as the temp moves up. The correct functioning of this sensor is
critical to the smooth running of the engine, especially during warm
up - the ECU uses resistance measurements to guage the length of time
the injectors are open.
The thermistor has the following temp/resistance characteristics:
Degrees C Ohms
-10 9100 - 9300
0 5700 - 5900
20 2400 - 2600
40 1100 - 1300
60 500 - 700
80 300 - 400
100 150 - 200
2. A THERMOTIME switch which controls the firing of the cold start
injector (the US spec RR does not have a cold start injector -
therefore no thermotime switch). It contains both a switch and a
heater. When the ignition switch is in the start (cranking) position,
power is supplied to the cold start injector and to the heater of the
thermotime switch. If the engine is warm the switch will be open so no
ground (earth) is made in the Cold start injector circuit so it
doesn't fire. If the engine is cold the switch is closed so a complete
circuit is made and the injector fires - as the engine is being
cranked power to the heater within the switch causes it to heat up
opening the internal switch and thus turning off the injector. This
prevents too much fuel being pumped into the engine and flooding it if
it doesn't start. The heater will cause the switch to open in less
than 10 seconds even in very cold conditions. Power is supplied to the
cold start injector only when cranking, so unless the injector is
leaking it is unlikely to be causing any cold running problems as you
described - it would run rich and you would probably have hot start
problems if the injector leaked.
I don't know where the thermo-time switch is located relative to the
coolant temp thermistor - but they are close together and you should
be able to trace the wiring from the injector to the thermotime switch
to figure out which one is which.
3. The third sensor is the sensor for the coolant temp gauge.
4. The fourth sensor is the switch for the electric fans - if fitted
on A/C equipped vehicles.
My money is still on the thermistor (#1) above.
Sorry for the long winded response.
Regards
Mike Lenaghan
> Subject: Temperature sensors.
> Author: hdavies@kzin.mon.rnb.com (Hugh J.E. Davies) at inetmail
[ truncated by lro-digester (was 36 lines)]
> Personal email to huge@axalotl.demon.co.uk, please.
> LINECOUNT 607 /var/mail/rro-daily.29781
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END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST
Input: messages 11 lines 607 [forwarded 100 whitespace 170]
Output: lines 456 [content 338 forwarded 35 (cut 65) whitespace 132]
Additional Information:
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Useful commands for this are 'index uk-lro-digest' which returns a list of
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Range Rover World Wide Web Sites start at
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If Major Domo barfs at something, and you're convinced he should have
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-B
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