The Coil Sprung (Land-Rover) Owner List Daily Digest

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From: Chris_Browne@US014-BOSTON-MINET.CCMAIL.CompuServe.COM
Date: 17 May 96 09:59:53 EDT
Subject: Re: Contoured Racks

     Hi all
     
     Since the Wan rover arrived, I've found myself doing some really dumb 
     things. 
     
     I totally forgot when I emailed you all for a description of these 
     racks that I took advantage of Safety devices advert in LRO and sent 
     over a request for info not really expecting a reply. Well they 
     delivered on the promise
     
     Included in the detailed mailing are pictures of the highlander and 
     expedition racks. I hope that they are prettier in person than the 
     pictures make them look. Really don't like the style of either of 
     these (the rack is contoured down and around the rook line towards the 
     gutter) but the design does help protect the roof from branches etc so 
     it does have value. 
     
     The Highlander style is something of a cross between the camel style 
     on the bottom and brownchurch 91 system on the sides. picture shows it 
     on a car with sunroof and roof bars, difficult to tell if there are 
     one or two lamp mounts on this unit. Expedition comes complete with 4 
     light mounts and marine ply floor- looks more like a shopping cart on 
     a car.
     
     Best looking SD rack is their Slavin expedition style for the 
     Defender. Now thats a rack I could buy without hesitation. But they 
     don't list it for the disco. BOO HISS!
     
     regards
     chris browne

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 09:15:40 -0600 (MDT)
From: "Douglas C. Marbourg" <marbourg@lanl.gov>
Subject: RE: Rear Droop Kit

>Yikes! Your subject line scared me! 
>When you said droop, I immediatly thought you'd LOWERED your rover 2".
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>music from the super-turbo sub-woofer, etc.)  Whew! I'm glad it was just
>a dream. :-)

Well, here in New Mexico, there is a town called Espanola which has been
coveted as the Low Ridder capital of the US.  You've got me re-thinking my
intentions for my D90.  Maybe I will LOWER the vehicle.  Hmmmm...Yea, I'll
cut the springs down 4"...no...6", and install hydraulics.  Then I can cruz
the booleivard, look cool and then pump up the the hydraulics back to stock
height for off-road trips. Imagine the possibilities!  Can I get 13"x14"
spoker rims to fit a Rover axle bolt pattern?  Sure I'll loose some
clearance, but the wider foot print should do better in sand, yes?  I guess
the next issue would be to recalibrate my spedo. for highway speeds.  Any ideas?

Doug Marbourg, '94 NAS D90 #1123

Santa Fe, New Mexico
(505)665-1729 work
(505)983-3574 home
marbourg@lanl.gov work
marbourg@juno.com home

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 96 11:18:27 EDT
From: rdl@NomuraNY.COM (Rob Legerio)
Subject: unsubscribing

All,
	Today is my last day here at NSI so, I will be unsubscribing
later today. I'll be back when I get my new email setup at the firm
I'm going to.  Probably be a few weeks.  Please don't send any
email to this address after today.

Anyway, the D90 and I will be road trippin it down to NC for
a week of wreck diving while I'm off. So, if anybody between
here and there sees a yellow 90 with the back piled high with
scuba gear... YOU BETTER WAVE OR ELSE I'LL HARPOON YOU :-)

Miss you already,
Rob

=============================================================================
  _________  |        Robert D. Leggiero                    rdl@NomuraNY.Com
 |     | \ \ |        Nomura Securities International       (212) 667-1958
#|_____|__\]\|____    Two World Financial Center, 20th Fl.
#|"___ |-   | ___ |   New York, N.Y.  10281-1198
[|/ - \|____|/ - \|]
  ( o ) ---- ( o )    1994 Defender 90 (AA Yellow, #1894)
=============================================================================

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 10:23:19 -0600
From: William Owen <IB011CA@smtpaoc.tsc.state.tn.us>
Subject:  Using an applesause brain to recover a stuck vehicle -Reply

My even more embarrassing story:

A couple of days ago at lunch I drove my 90 Rangie down to a piece of
land, soon to be a subdivision, where my parents have recently
purchased a lot.  Its been staked out now and I wanted to see how the
lines turned out.  It was a sunny day and having driven all over the
property in my J**p, even in serious rain, I didn't think twice about pulling
just off the road into the weeds to take a look. 

 I instantly knew I was in trouble. 

I found I could move only one way, sideways away from the road down
a very gradual slop.  Every time I tried to move, I just slipped farther from
the road.  My back tires had no traction at all.   Suddenly trying to get a
couple of more months out of the worn Michelins 244s that came on my
new RR didn't seem like such a good idea.  The mud was not thick at all,
only about an inch and covered in weeds, but, despite all my great off
road skill :) , I was unable to move towards the road at all.  Worse,  I
was getting closer to a pond at the bottom of the slope!  

So here I am, in a suit and wingtips, on my lunch hour, stuck in only 1
inch of mud in a Range Rover, and about to walk ? a mile to ask a
construction worker with a pick up truck for a pull.  (at least I had my
recovery straps and a RN military recovery loop).  Not on a trail ride or
even at the in-law's farm, but in a subdivision 30 feet from a paved road!
The shame.

Just as I was about to give up so as not to slip further toward the
water, I spotted a small wash out right by the pond which had gravel in
it.  Taking the risk of getting really stuck, I managed to slip between trees
down to the gully where the gravel allowed me to get traction.  I then
blasted up the gully  (Rover much better at this than J**p) and had
enough momentum to reach the road.  Feeling very embarrassed and
glad to be free without any witnesses, I determined to get new tires
immediately, perhaps a winch, and, most importantly, a more intelligent
driver for my beloved Rangie.

In retrospect, I had several other options before I gave up, although
none would have left me looking very good for work that afternoon. 
Stupid situation to get into in the first place, although it did turn a few
heads to return to work in a very freshly mudded Rover.

I think mud (and stupid drivers) may be the Rover's Achillie's heel.  It
has done fantastic on all the other short, technical, non muddy trails I've
been on since I got it last month.  I just need more time and experience
with it to learn what it is and is not capable of compared to my previous
vehicles. And what I am and am not capable ot too.  Can't wait to get it
on a real trail ride.

Blessed are the humble.  And I was definitely humbled.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:30:04 -0700
From: Russ Burns <burns@cisco.com>
Subject: Re: Using an applesause brain to recover a stuck vehicle

I have done a lot of off roading with my wife and daughter (6 now)
one our own. We spent two weeks exploring the Canyon lands when our
daughter was 6 months old. Getting stuck is reality. Plan for it.
When I offroad I plan to get stuck. I bring Food, water, warm cloths,
sleeping bags, first aid kits, and any other items I might need.
The more remote the area, the more I take. I also turn back before I
get stranded.
The other recomendation I can make, is practice getting stuck.
Find a mud hole, take the wive and kids, maybe another support vehicle
if it makes you feel comfortable and then bury the truck to the gills
in the mud. At this point don't attempt to get the truck un-stuck,
but instead have a picnic lunch and admire you work. After lunch (no beer)
think of a plan to recover you truck. If the first plan does not work,
take a break and try another angle.
Learn not to panic when you are stuck. This takes practice.

Above all have fun, and stay safe.

Russ Burns

 

At 08:34 AM 5/17/96 -0500, David C. McCormack wrote:
>At 07:05 PM 5/16/96 -0700, Robert Watson wrote:
>>When things come to slurping halt and I'm up to the axles, miles from
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 24 lines)]
>(414)792-9150
>(414) 792-9154 (fax)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 08:41:06 -0700
From: Christopher Boese <cboese@co.san-bernardino.ca.us>
Subject: Re: Disco

Robert C. Hanson had...

> a few questions/problems about/with my disco.

> Does anybody have a rattling/vibrating rear panel that surrounds the
> subwoofer?  It is obviously a product of the bass,  but that sound should
> not be sooo bad.  Had dealer look at it a couple times but nothing ever
> seems to be done.

I've heard this, as have a couple of others. I had another creak/rattle back there (dry 
door hinges) but the dealer, no doubt hoping for a fat reimbursement for warranty work, 
removed the entire rear panel, wrapped the wires and things around the subwoofer with 
tape, and reassembled everything. The subwoofer buzzed less after that, but my Mack 10 
and Ice Cube tapes bring it back from time to time.

> At the  car wash I had a waterfall coming through the back door. Any way
> to remedy this (the door was shut)?

I hate to be the bearer of depressing news, but someone else on the list (I should have 
saved his name and message) had this "feature" and, I regret to say, it was because the 
door had been mounted improperly (too much ale the night before in Solihull) and a body 
shop had to remount the door. I've also had water leaks in this area, only from around 
the speakers, which proved to be a panel seam that hadn't been sealed. In any case, 
there's no excuse for this sort of sloppy build quality.

> Last but not least does anyone have problems with the signalling bulbs. I
> had mine replaced twice already due to "loose connections."

Every couple of days, my right rear bulb just stops working and the blinkers start 
blinking like 1970's disco strobe lights. A few miles later the light is back. Probably 
just the right vibration reseats the connector back there.

It could be worse. A friend with a Jeep has all these sorts of problems too, and he 
still has to drive a Jeep. Good luck getting everything resolved.

-- 
Christopher Boese
County of San Bernardino, California
Information Services, Information Systems Security Office
'95 beluga black Discovery V8i

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:43:13 -0700
From: Russ Burns <burns@cisco.com>
Subject: Re: Using an applesause brain to recover a stuck vehicle

I should append this for the Hard core northern mud groupies.
The technique is to load a land rover with beer, drive itinto the mud until
only the roof is visable, drink beer, drink beer, and when the
beer is gone, extract the landrover, drive for more beer, and
start over......

>Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:30:04 -0700
>To: "David C. McCormack" <dmccorma@execpc.com>, "Robert Watson (CNA)"
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 56 lines)]
>>Brookfield, WI 53045
>>(414)792-9150
>>(414) 792-9154 (fax)

------------------------------

From: KKelly6788@aol.com
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 12:00:30 -0400
Subject: Shovels

>The technique that Bob talks about is to use a "dead-man".  Basically, 
>you'd take that log that you chopped up, bury it at least 3ft down (the 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>the log's trench, thereby possibly causing the log to lift out of the 
>trench.

After reading about all this digging, I wanted to remind everyone that a full
size shovel makes this a lot easier.  I always put a full size shovel on the
Range Rover's roof rack when I go off road. (and when I go skiing it sits in
the ski rack next to all the skis).  A few weeks ago I was on a muddy road
with a friend near the coast in his S-10 Blazer.  We were turning around and
the front end dropped down in to a muddy hole.  We pulled the "shift on the
fly lever" in to low range and tried to back out.  The front tires were
slipping in the wet goo and the rear tires were almost up in the air and were
not getting any traction.  I tried jumping up and down on the rear bumper
but, I guess I didn't weigh enough.  We looked around and saw a couple good
size trees, got the receiver mounted winch out of the back, slid it in to the
receiver and hooked it up.  Unfortunately we forgot Murphy's other law of
winching, that "if there are plenty of trees nearby, the winch will not
work".  We tested the plug and we had 12V and a good ground but nothing from
the winch (It worked perfectly in my friends driveway when we got home)  Now
for the point on why I started typing, all my friend had was one of those
mini folding army surplus shovels.  We did get out after jacking up the front
and digging dirt from under the frame and throwing it under the front tires,
but it took about a half hour longer with the little shovel.

Kevin Kelly

------------------------------

From: KKelly6788@aol.com
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 12:00:52 -0400
Subject: Things to cut wood with

>I noticed that the CT Disco has a Big Ax securely fastened to the roof
>rack. I guess that's something else to add to the load.

I always keep a small ax with me, but If planning to go off road I will bring
my chain saw.  I just got a nice plastic case for it so it won't leak all
over the "plushmobile" (it also seems to contain the gas smell).  A month ago
in the Santa Cruz mtns. I was on a skid trail and after rounding a corner I
saw that a 2' diameter tree had blown down in a storm across the trail.  It
would have taken two days to cut through it with the ax, the chain saw had
the trail passable in no time.  A tip from experience, always start the chain
saw at home before you head out.  It is a lot easier the fix a problem with a
fouled plug or a clogged fuel filter when you are at home with all your tools
than on the trail.  One more thing I keep in the Range Rover every day is a
folding Craftsman bow saw (about $10) It is amazing how fast this thing will
cut through a big branch.  I just used it this weekend, I had two mountain
bikes on the roof rack and I couldn't get down a narrow street a friend lived
on in Marin.  I had to cut a 2" diameter branch that hooked on one of the
bike handle bars.

Kevin Kelly

------------------------------

From: Brian Neill Tiedemann <s914440@minyos.its.rmit.EDU.AU>
Subject: defender rear alxes...axles even
Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 02:06:19 +1000 (EST)

Sorry to be silent for ages, then pop in and out as I do, but here I go
again....
D130 rear axles are _significantly_ different to Disco or RR axles!
The D130 has a Salisbury Rear diff a-la series LR (actually really similar
to a Dana 60 as seen in many a pickup/light truck)-without the series leaf
springs of course.

Much: Heavier
      Stronger
      "Cruder"

I like em... my RR likes its one too.(actually from a LR "County" -early
oz 110 + disc brakes + Brian [tm] ;) diff lock)

Besides the increase in unsprung weight, there is also about 1" ground
clearance loss under the centre of the housing cf rover flat bottom diff
housings. I personally think that the peace of mind is worthwhile.
I say this because the time I broke an axle (rover type) a TLC towed me
home, and the same TLC towed me home _last_ time I broke a diff centre.
This is an embarassment to be avoided by rover folk at all costs...
At least if they tow you out of a bog someplace, your neighbours don't see
it!

To break a 12 bold LR Salisbury diff or axle is possible, but I have only
seen it done by oz army grunts. The housing had one leg broken clean
off. This was no fluke either, I have seen two, one broken on the short
side, the other on the long. Probably run over by a tank :)
Should stand up to all I can throw at it.

cu
Brian.
(contemplating 4-doorifying my 77 2door RR)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 00:07:03 +0800
From: Oscar <omont@mnl.sequel.net>
Subject: Re: 89 NAS RR temp

At 08:12 AM 5/17/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Oscar,
>Just on a whim, does your truck have a voltage stabalizer in the instrument
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 20 lines)]
>Larry Smith
>Chester, VA
============================

Hi Larry :

Will give your suggestion a try.  And I have this strange feeling you're
right on the nail.

And I wasted money on those other things?!!

Thanks Larry.

Oscar
with spare sensors

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 00:07:32 +0800
From: Oscar <omont@mnl.sequel.net>
Subject: Re: 89 NAS RR temp

>At 04:36 AM 5/17/96 +0800, you wrote:
>>Got a mystery here.  The temperature gauge, normally at 6 o'clock, is acting
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 29 lines)]
>David
>1988 RR
>And I wave!
==================

David :

Spoke to Lanny at RN and told him the problem.  He suspects its the same
thing and getting the part out to me.

Given my driving conditions, if it were the water pump the temp would
consistently be high but this isn't the case.

Thanks, will update you on results.

On to the next problem!!!

Oscar
(with spare sensors)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 09:27:36 -0700
From: Bruce.Curtis@sun.com (Bruce Curtis)
Subject: Re: Disco

> From hansonrc@medeiros4.npt.nuwc.navy.mil  Thu May 16 15:58:20 1996
<snip>
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 13 lines)]
> not be sooo bad.  Had dealer look at it a couple times but nothing ever 
> seems to be done.
I have found two sources, one is the license plate and/or holder. I removed
the holder and bolted the plate with four screws, this improved the problem
but still a rattle is herd. So, i started trying to isolate the problem, the
best i can see/hear is that it's now the subwoofer assembly itself, haven't
had it into the dealer to check it out. No clue as to how to fix it.

> At the  car wash I had a waterfall coming through the back door. Any way 
> to remedy this (the door was shut)?
> Hello out there
Never had this problem (although i don't was mine much :)

> Is  it hard to wire a non-rover CD changer and will it work through the 
> rover stereo?
> Hello out there
It's a Pioneer brand stereo, so i'd guess that it's a Pioneer connector.
I plan on hooking some other audio sources through this connector (HAM, CB)
so when i get around to figuring out the pin-out i'll post it.

> Where can I get that rack that was on that Invitations/Quest mailing.
> You know the one,  it was molded (contoured) to the dual level disco 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
> Last but not least does anyone have problems with the signalling bulbs. I 
> had mine replaced twice already due to "loose connections."
Not me.

> It seems to me that whenever I see the Camel Trophy discos, they all have 
> thew front spoiler taken (ripped?) off. Is that something that is easy to 
> do before going offroading.
> Last but not least does anyone have problems with the signalling bulbs. I 
Other then pulling apart one side from the front portion of the spooler once
i haven't had any problems with it off-road.

Later, Bruce.
'95 Disco
--
Bruce W. Curtis                     brutus@Eng.Sun.COM
SunSoft, Internet Engineering       http://www.badrc.org/~brutus
2550 Garcia Ave, MS MPK17-202       (415)786-5147
Mountain View, CA 94043-1100        FAX:(415)786-5896

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@MICROSOFT.com>
Subject: RE: Shovels
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 09:27:46 -0700

I'd heard from another fellow that you could use the shovel as an anchor
as well, It just takes your "co-pilot" to hold the handle and you want
the hook to be as close to the ground as possible. It probably won't
handle the full 8000# capacity of the winch, but it might be worth a try
in otherwise dire circumstances. (use at your own risk, of course). Also
as Kevin pointed out in his message, they move dirt pretty well, too.

-- Bob W.
'95 shovel equipped Discovery

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@MICROSOFT.com>
Subject: RE: Using an applesause brain to recover a stuck vehicle
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 09:30:26 -0700

Great! just one more thing to add to the already overloaded Discovery: 4
cases of beer! (though for me, a 6-pack is plenty to make me forget
about the submerged vehicle :-) 

>From your description, these should probably go on the roof rack (for
easy access) right?  Boy, I can see the need for the reinforced,
hi-capacity roof rack already!

-- Bob W.
>----------
>From: 	Russ Burns[SMTP:burns@cisco.com]
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 13 lines)]
>only the roof is visable, drink beer, drink beer, and when the
>beer is gone, extract the landrover, drive for more beer, and
>start over......

------------------------------

From: crash@merl.com
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 12:28:42 -0400
Subject: Lug nuts - 27mm versus 1-1/16"

   >27 mm = 1.063 inches = 1 1/16 inches so using a 1 and 1 sixteenth inch
   socket is
   >an alternative for the colonists who cannot find a 27 mm , they are probably
   >badge engineered anyway!!

I missed that option too- salesweeners do that to me .  The lug 
nut I took off and with me didn't fit the Snap-On 1-1/16 as well 
as it fit the Snap-On 27mm.  I also confess I didn't even bother 
checking the inch size sockets at Sears.  England's been metric 
for so long, I figured they _had_ to have metric lug bolts.  
Yeah, *right*.  :-)

But we should remember that both Craftsman and Snap-On don't make
sockets to exactly 27mm plus lube tolerance.  Snap-On's been 
making their "flank drive" face-driving sockets for many many
years, and Craftsman switched over to a very similar corner-relieved
design somewhat recently (fewer than eight years ago, I believe,
because my older Craftsman socket set is NOT the new design,
but their new sockets ARE corner-relieved)

Given that the fit of these non-hexagonal drivers is not necessarily
snug, (and the nominal sizes only differ by .000492 inch) it's hard 
to say what the actually the right size is.  It's a lug bolt, not
a camshaft journal!

	-Bill Y.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 09:47:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Brabyn <brabyn@skivs.ski.org>
Subject: Re: RR Exterior Spare Tire Mount?

John I saw one advertised the other day -- I think it was DAP that had them.

Cheers

John Brabyn
89RR

On Thu, 16 May 1996, John Cassidy wrote:

> I don't think this is a duplicate post...sorry in advance if it is!  Does
> anyone know of an exterior, rear mounted, spare tire carrier for the RR?
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 15 lines)]
> Bangor, Maine USA
> 2 Wheels: Ducati M900, Velocette Thruxton, Moto Morini 350S
> 4 Wheels: 1995 Discovery, 1987 Range Rover, 1966 Series IIA

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 09:51:46 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Brabyn <brabyn@skivs.ski.org>
Subject: Re: LR / RR Lug Nuts

I always use a 1 1/16 socket for my lug nuts -- I was under the illusion 
that that was the actual size!!

Cheers

John Brabyn
89RR

On 16 May 1996, William L. Leacock wrote:

> 27 mm = 1.063 inches = 1 1/16 inches so using a 1 and 1 sixteenth inch socket is
> an alternative for the colonists who cannot find a 27 mm , they are probably
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> badge engineered anyway!!
>  Regards  Bill Leacock  Limey in exile.

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 13:25:59 -0400
Subject: Re: Used Rovers

In a message dated 96-05-16 22:09:23 EDT, rover@pinn.net (Alexander P. Grice)
writes:
  I was looking at a '90 back in December...and as a used car, 
>the credit union was going to charge two points higher than the "new" car 
>rate.  By the time we got to the credit union in January to sign the papers,

>it was now a *six* year old car *and they wouldn't make the loan*.  They 
>finally relented, but we still didn't like paying almost 10% for a used 
>Rangie. 

Congrats on dinging up your new bumper Alexander.  (This has got to be the
ONLY place in the world where scratching up a new car is considered fine!, in
fact, encouraged!)

And that's what I wondered about, was how far back the credit union would go
loan wise.  I figured they'd charge a few points, but didn't know about the
model year acceptability.
Thanks.
John.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 13:30:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: defender rear alxes...axles even

On Sat, 18 May 1996, Brian Neill Tiedemann wrote:

> D130 rear axles are _significantly_ different to Disco or RR axles!
> The D130 has a Salisbury Rear diff a-la series LR (actually really similar
> to a Dana 60 as seen in many a pickup/light truck)-without the series leaf
> springs of course.

	The Salisbury axle found on the Series Land Rovers is actually
	a Dana 40.  So when your cover plate begins to get soft, er rotten,
	all you have to do is go to your local truck stop and pick one up.
	Much cheaper than asking about for a Salisbury.  They look at you 
	as if you were from a different planet.  This also implies that
	you will spend more on the flat black cover plate, than you spend
	on the one that is chromed...  :-)

	Rgds,

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 10:42:48 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Brabyn <brabyn@skivs.ski.org>
Subject: Re: defender rear alxes...axles even

Is the RR rear (or front) axle really a Dana as well???

Cheers

John Brabyn
89RR

On Fri, 17 May 1996, Dixon Kenner wrote:

> On Sat, 18 May 1996, Brian Neill Tiedemann wrote:
> > D130 rear axles are _significantly_ different to Disco or RR axles!
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 20 lines)]
> 	on the one that is chromed...  :-)
> 	Rgds,

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 13:47:48 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: defender rear alxes...axles even

On Fri, 17 May 1996, John Brabyn wrote:

> Is the RR rear (or front) axle really a Dana as well???

	Not a clue on the Range Rover axles.  Just picked up a 109
	rolling chassis (for the fairey capstan winch and Salisbury
	axle) and the cover plate was a bit soft.  I knew it was American
	so it was just a bunch of phone calls to figure it out.
	Hmmm, if the RR was Yankee too...  This is interesting.
	Something to check out...

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@MICROSOFT.com>
Subject: RE: Crested Butte
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:00:09 -0700

I got my invitation in yesterday's mail :-) and I'll be sending it out
in today's mail!

Are there any camping areas in the neighorhood? Any recommendations?

>----------
>From: 	GElam30092@aol.com[SMTP:GElam30092@aol.com]
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 17 lines)]
>event.
> Their number is 970-349-5542.
    _____
   /|__|_\__(|                           Bob Watson
  |   |   |  \                 a-robw@microsoft.com
  |---|___|___\____      Mountlake Terrace, WA, USA 
  |~~_|=  |=  |o_  }\                
 [|_/_ \__|___|/_\_}|    '95 Beluga Black Discovery
    \_/        \_/                            N7UMU

>----------

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 14:27:42 -0400
Subject: Superb Dealer Service
From: "Andrew A. Dallas" <adallas@systemsoft.com>

I dropped off my D90 this week for warrantee work at Land Rover Metro 
West in Natick, MA. I was hoping to have most of the work completed. As 
any D90 owner knows, the vehicles had a few production problems. I really 
wasn't expecting too much as there were about 10 problems that would 
require quite a bit of labor. 

I was very supprised to find that LRMW had completed ALL of the repairs 
except for a minor one for which they have ordered the part. They even 
replaced some expensive parts free of charge that I hadn't expected. I 
was expecting LRMW to give me a hard time about the volume of repairs I 
was requesting but found everyone there friendly, polite and 
accomodating. I spoke with one of their engineers who I believe to be 
their lead mechanic and he spent the time to explain the proper way to 
change a D90's oil without losing the pump prime. He spent the time to 
explain why the pump might lose it's prime and a few tricks to try if 
mine ever does lose it's prime due to an incorrect oil change. Mike, the 
service representative was also patient with me and took the time to make 
sure all repairs that I had requested were completed and reviewed the 
list with me to make sure I was satisfied. 

If you plan to take your vehicle to a dealer, I would suggest trying Land 
Rover Metro West. If you're outside of MA, I hope you have a dealer 
that's as good.

Thanks LRMW.
-AD 

************************************************************************
 Andrew A. Dallas
 Full Spectrum Software, Inc.
 30 Whittemore Road
 Newton, MA 02158, USA

 (617) 969-7216, On Site Office: (508) 647-2948
 email: adallas@tiac.net, Web Page: http://www.tiac.net/users/adallas/
************************************************************************

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 96 15:14:43 -0400
From: "barnett childress" <barnett=childress%Eng%EMCHOP1@fishbowl02.lss.emc.com>
Subject: re: Superb Dealer Service

Andrew,
I have also had good luck with LRMW. All problems I've had have been 
covered under warranty and taken care of right away, without any argument. 
They also take the time to show me what they have done.
Overall I have been very satisfied with their efforts. If they have any 
delays in processing the paperwork they send me on my way, so I don't have 
to wait, and mail me the paperwork detailing what was done.
Cheers,
Barnett  
-------------
Original Text
From: "Andrew A. Dallas" <adallas@systemsoft.com>, on 5/17/96 2:27 PM:
I dropped off my D90 this week for warrantee work at Land Rover Metro 
West in Natick, MA. I was hoping to have most of the work completed. As 
any D90 owner knows, the vehicles had a few production problems. I really 
wasn't expecting too much as there were about 10 problems that would 
require quite a bit of labor. 

I was very supprised to find that LRMW had completed ALL of the repairs 
except for a minor one for which they have ordered the part. They even 
replaced some expensive parts free of charge that I hadn't expected. I 
was expecting LRMW to give me a hard time about the volume of repairs I 
was requesting but found everyone there friendly, polite and 
accomodating. I spoke with one of their engineers who I believe to be 
their lead mechanic and he spent the time to explain the proper way to 
change a D90's oil without losing the pump prime. He spent the time to 
explain why the pump might lose it's prime and a few tricks to try if 
mine ever does lose it's prime due to an incorrect oil change. Mike, the 
service representative was also patient with me and took the time to make 
sure all repairs that I had requested were completed and reviewed the 
list with me to make sure I was satisfied. 

If you plan to take your vehicle to a dealer, I would suggest trying Land 
Rover Metro West. If you're outside of MA, I hope you have a dealer 
that's as good.

Thanks LRMW.
-AD 

************************************************************************
 Andrew A. Dallas
 Full Spectrum Software, Inc.
 30 Whittemore Road
 Newton, MA 02158, USA

 (617) 969-7216, On Site Office: (508) 647-2948
 email: adallas@tiac.net, Web Page: http://www.tiac.net/users/adallas/
************************************************************************

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 96 16:09:56 EDT
From: rdl@NomuraNY.COM (Rob Legerio)

unsubscribe

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 15:20:34 -0500
From: Shaun Carrigan <shaunc@infi.net>
Subject: Kentucky Trail

Amy,

There is a very neat and challenging four-wheel road up to Hensley Flats
near Middlesboro, Ky. It is part of the Cumberland Gap National
Historical Park. I can't recall exactly how to get to it but you can get
directions from the park rangers. You take a paved road north from Hwy
25E just east of Middlesboro for several miles. The four-wheel road
turns east off the paved road. It climbs four or five miles up the
mountain with sharp switchbacks and lots of rock-hopping. It's safe if
you take it slow and easy but the unlucky could break an axle or roll
off the side of the mountain. Very exciting for back seat parents. The
climb takes about an hour if I remember correctly. On top it's beautiful
with a restored pioneer settlement atop a 4,000 foot mountain with great
views of the valley and surrounding mountains. The only other access is
by park bus up a private road. If you're adventurous there are also many
logging and mining trails in the area. Let me know how it goes if you
make the trip!

Shaun Carrigan
'88 RR

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@MICROSOFT.com>
Subject: LR Rallye @ Crested Butte, CO
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 13:21:29 -0700

Here's a brief summary of the events as taken and condensed from the
invitation:

Sponsored by:
	(brief commercial plug)
	LRNA, RN & BP 
	(if you don't know these initials by now, you haven't been paying
attention)
	
Special Guests:
	Bill Burke, former US Camel Trophy team member & current 4WD tour guide
	Geof Miller, Progect Engineer of the Velar/Range Rover
	Others to be announced

Schedule:
	Wed, 7 Aug:	Check-in @ Nordic Inn, Crested Butte, CO
	Thur, 8 Aug:	0900 leave for rockies to have picnic lunch
			1730 return to town
			1800 Welcome party @ Nordic Inn
	Fri, 9 Aug: 	0900 leave for another picnic in the rockies
			1730 return to town
			you're on your own for dinner tonight.
	Sat, 10 Aug:	0900 leave for yet another picnic in the rockies
			1730 return to town
			1830 catered dinner @ Lazy "F" ranch
	Sun. 11 Aug: 	TBA
	Mon, 12 Aug: 	pack up and go exploring (or go home) on your own
	
$$$$$
	Registration: $50/vehicle
	Nordic Inn:$60/night DBL (rallye attendees get 10% off, but room tax is
10%)

###
	Information on rallye:
		Greg Chernushin: Day: 719-635-5885, eve: 719-481-3603
		Rooms @ Nordic Inn: 970-349-5542

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 15:58:05 -0500
From: Shaun Carrigan <shaunc@infi.net>
Subject: Lucky escape, then doomed by Lucas

This story ends with a question, so I'll try to keep it short. I was 
looking for rocks for a new garden pond along a little creek I know 
about 60 miles from town. A trail known as River "Road" winds along the 
creek, fording it several times through dense woods. It's a remote area. 
The rocks I wanted were in the creekbed about 200 yards down from the 
ford. A gravel and rock shoal made a convenient, though foot-deep path 
to the rocks so off I went down the stream.
I loaded 300 or 400 pounds of handsome rocks into a tarp spread in the 
back of my '88 Range Rover and managed to turn around to head back up to 
my point of entry. Then the thought crossed my mind that the rocks might 
become a weighty problem. I locked the differential and forged upstream, 
observing that the water seemed much deeper than before! The sinking 
feeling was not only in my stomach as the Rover ground to a halt and dug 
in. With water up to the doors I reflected briefly, slammed into reverse 
and managed to spin back a few feet. Abandoning everything I know about 
slow going, I punched the accelerator, gained some momentum and managed 
to slalom my way out with a pretty bow wave flowing well over the 
bumper. I'd made it! Off I went, observing the body was almost down to 
the rear stops. Everything was fine for about two minutes. Then, 
disaster. The Rover died without warning. Water in the electrics, I 
surmised.

The painful end of the story is that I couldn't start again and was two 
miles from the nearest paved road. Luckily, a couple of teen-agers came 
along in Toyota pick up and carried me back to the nearest town. Not a 
place where they work on Rovers. It ended with a tow all the way back to 
the city.

Now the question. The dealer replaced an electronic module and connector 
wire on the distributor. The story was, the failure was unconnected to 
the watery incident and was just bad luck, a part that is known to fail. 
I'd never heard of it and it worries me to think another dinky part 
might strand me somewhere... Not something I would have thought to put 
in the emergency kit. Anyone have experience with faulty distributor 
modules? It's a $140 gizmo that bolts into the bottom front of the 
distributor.

-- Shaun Carrigan

------------------------------

From: Chris_Browne@US014-BOSTON-MINET.CCMAIL.CompuServe.COM
Date: 17 May 96 16:58:35 EDT
Subject: Re[2]: Superb Dealer Service

     
     My disco goes in for its 15k service 5/28 at LRMW. a few dinky things 
     plus one serious thing to sort out. The diff lock has disappeared. The 
     lever will not even move to the left, but hi-lo is ok. This is a 
     reoccurrence of a problem complained about at 11k when I had a block 
     heater installed.
     Back then at least I could move the lever, but the diff lock light 
     came on without moving the lever. The lever was very difficult to move 
     back then, but the concrete has now set and no sideways movement 
     exists
     
     I suspect that the transfer box is going to have to be dropped. 
     I am determined to get this problem sorted once and for all.  I cannot 
     risk taking the car off road in its current condition, as I'll get 
     stuck too quickly. 
     at least this time I have a nut that I found on the floor right 
     underneath the t box to give to them. 

        I'll post a message once the car comes out from surgery.

Chris Browne      

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 22:42:29 -0400
Subject: Re: Lucky escape, then doomed by Lucas

In a message dated 96-05-17 17:01:19 EDT, you write:

>ow the question. The dealer replaced an electronic module and connector 
>wire on the distributor. The story was, the failure was unconnected to 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
>distributor.
>-- Shaun Carrigan

Shaun, 
my only connection with Range Rover electrics is this exact part.  A RR owner
a bout 2 blocks from me had his truck parked during a very cold spell here,
teh minus 25 one, and afterwards it wouldn't start.  Turns out it was that
ignition module.  OK, replaced.  Awhile later, it won't start again. Same
module went bad, fortunatlely teh dealer warranted it and it was replaced for
free.

My buddy is teh mechanic that worked on it, says he's seen it before.  And  I
assume there aren't a whole LOT of RRs in madison, so maybe it IS common? or
at least common enough to keep an extra... ?.

John.
D90 for sale.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 10:52:21 +0800
From: Oscar <omont@mnl.sequel.net>
Subject: Re: 89 NAS RR temp

At 09:28 AM 5/17/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Are you sure it's actually heating up? It's more likely to be the gauge 
>-- specifically the temperature sender.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
>Cheers
>John
====================

Unfortunately, sender's been changed with still the same results.  I don't
think its really heating up but don't want to chance it.  We've got hour
traffic jams in 90 degree weather.  It _does_ make one insecure in
situations like that.

Oscar
(spare sensors/senders)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 22:56:27 -0500
From: Jeff & Laura Kessler <lmkessler@srnet.com>
Subject: Camel Trophy Disco Springs

A few days ago somebody posted that they noticed a non standard arrangement
of springs at the rear of a CT Disco they peaked under.

Today at work I remembered that I had been give a reprint of an article on
the 1995 Camel Trophy that includes the following sentence..."Helper springs
are added in the rear for extra cargo weight, and skidplates protect each
differential."

The reprint is from the October 1995 issue of FOUR WHEELER magazine.

No details of the tires were provided except for the tread pattern visible
in the pictures.

BTW, how many CT Discos are there around?  I saw a CT Disco look a like at
Rovers North last fall but did not examine it closely.  Are these true CT
prepped Discos or simply decal-ed promo Discos like the "Indy 500" pace cars
look a likes dealers get?

Jeff Kessler
1988 Range Rover
Newport NH  USA   603-863-7883

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 22:56:29 -0500
From: Jeff & Laura Kessler <lmkessler@srnet.com>
Subject: Front End Alignment 

A few days (nights) ago James Carley told how to check the toe-out on the RR
using the "Trammel Rod Method" (which I believe I have heard of before).

As I reported that night, I measured about 1 mm of toe-in but decided not to
try to adjust that night.  This morning the RR went in to the garage and had
the alignment checked on their big machine.  What do you know! They measured 
.04 inch of toe-in!  James, it certainly is a simply and reliable way to
check the toe-out, thanks again!

I am glad I did not try to adjust it the other night.  It took them about 20
minutes to free up the adjusting rod so it would turn smoothly.  I went out
front and read the paper while they worked on that part.

It may only be in my mind, but the RR seems to ride quieter now.

Jeff Kessler
1988 Range Rover
Newport NH USA   603-863-7883

------------------------------

From: Russell Burns <burns@cisco.com>
Subject: Expedition
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 17:52:48 -0700 (PDT)

It seemed a waste to own a landrover and only commute
 to work in the beast. So after considerable little thought I
decided to take the summer off, and trek off to Alaska.
Unfortunately I will miss the summer rally in Colorado, as
I will not be back until late August.

The Itinerary to date is as follows

Leave June 16 or so, travel  through the UP to Minnesota.
Drop the wife and daughter off as some mall, and go fishing
with an old friend.

Some time later in June I will be at the Big horn mountains in
Wyoming. 

>From there I am participation in an off-road Trialthion in
Colorado July 12 thu the 14.

>From there I head to Bellingham WA, drop off the trailer
at some friends in Gardner MT on the way, and catch the 
ferry to Skagway AK. We leave port on the 19 of July, and reach
Skagway on the 24 or so.  

>From there I am planing to head up to Ivnuk, pick up a rock
for another friend, then head to Denali Park.

The trip back will be down the Alaskan highway thru Banff, and
Glacier and then wander home to go back to work...

We are taking the D-90, so packing is a real challenge. I
have one of those roof top tents coming and am planning
to sew up a Nylon mesh loft for the inside of the D-90.
Since my daughter is only 6 years old, head room is not
a requirement.

If anyone is going to be in the Wyoming/Montana area June 20
thu July 10, let me know and we could do some trails together.
Also if any one know of some good trails in the Wyoming north
to Alaska area, let me know.

I am looking forward to a great trip, and if you see a Blue D-90
with Bikes on the front, tent on the roof, pulling a camper, 
honk a few times (I am a little slow sometimes) and I pull over
and say hello....

Russ Burns
94 D90
95 D-90 SW
91 R-Rover
Ps.
For those of you who attended the Colorado rally last year, My
friend Pat, his wife Joan, and three kids will not be able to
attend this year. Seems his wife is going to have twins!!!!!
In fact Pat is a little distraught that his family can not fit into
his Range Rover. If anyone knows of a real good deal on a D-110
let me know. (It will have to be a real good deal)

------------------------------

From: GElam30092@aol.com
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 23:53:33 -0400
Subject: Re: Crested Butte CO/National Land Rover Rally

In a message dated 96-05-17 20:50:26 EDT, you write:

>I got my invitation in yesterday's mail :-) and I'll be sending it out
>in today's mail!
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>in today's mail!
>Are there any camping areas in the neighorhood? Any recommendations?

With my wife, I don't dare ask about camping.  In fact, the last time we went
camping together was on the Outer Banks of NC during late June in 1986....
almost 10 years ago.   We are going to stay at the Nordic Inn since I'll have
both my wife, daughter and my parents too.  It's going to be a blast.  

Oh.. there is a Crested Butte Chamber of Commerce at 970-349-6438 or
1-800-545-4505.   They also have a reservations number at 1-800-215-2226.

Good luck!
Gerry

------------------------------

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