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From: "Dave Tilbury" <Dave@hants-lanes.demon.co.uk>
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 23:16:52 -0000
Subject: Re: Old father Time
If I do invite anyone from the list it will only be those that contribute.
I might invite a couple of glimmer members just so that we have someone to
chuck in the river.
Dave Tilbury
Dave@hants-lanes.demon.co.uk
http://www.hants-lanes.demon.co.uk
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From: davidg@hwcces.demon.co.uk (David Goode)
Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 12:57:38 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: Re: IT'S WAR!!!!
Damned motor bikes
Bought myself new bullbars today and by
11.00 this morning, some duffer on a BMW R80GS had parked outside
the village post office where I usually turn the Land Rover round.
Result = slight abrasion to paintwork = cost approx 000.
A pox on all motor bikes
Can I put a complaint to the omnibusman?
Sorry, that doesn't help either does it? I never did get the hang of
sympathy.
David Goode davidg@hwcces.demon.co.uk
Environmental Services Dept
Hereford and Worcester County Council
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From: Chris Marsden <Byway@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 07:39:40 -0500
Subject: Re: Dere Street
> Does anyone have good counters to the 'Ancient Monument' argument as it
> has appeared more than once up here.
Blooming Nimbys.
I do not think I got a complaint off, do you have a) email, or b) Fax no,
or if not he postal address, and I will do so.
[psThanks Howard, got it on your email]
The only evidence we have is that it was the wheel that made it what it is.
It was made when carts were thousands of times more common than now. The
current level and type of usage if motorised vehicles are prohibited is
such that it would change the nature and look of the road in a very few
years, FP or BW are common, and do not give the sense of history that a
road portrays. If properly maintained in acordance with the needs of those
that choose to use it, with traditional local stone, it will look such that
you can just imagine a coach and four galloping along.
roads can still be stoned as they always have, with minimal and
propermaintenance they will last literally for ever.
The modern pneaumatic tyre is so much softer than a steel rim, the load is
spread, and so much less wear occurs.
Sure limit the sped if well used by others to little more than walking
speed, thus reducing the disturbance, noise, fears that others might have,
reduce the desire for everyday traffic to use it, and also increase the
length of time passengers can enjoy the route for. In the extreme control
the times of access, but keeping the access avalable in some form that is
fair, does not discriminate against the disabled, infirm, elderly, or
simply minority groups is vital.
Please everyone, help save this road so that I can enjoy it as soon as I
can get there some day.
Chris
DT
>>Modern recreational vehicles cause less damage than agg vehs. or even
horses. The ground pressure of a horses hoof is far greater than that of a
rubber tyred wheel. the hoof marks hold water therefore keeping the lane
softer for longer and eventually lead to the deterioration of the
surface....
Not anti horse - just fact.
>>Modern recreational vehicles cause less damage than agg vehs. or even
Then wheels are needed when it half dry to firm it down again. Advantage
of multi user. If not edited out, Countryfile might show picys of just
such a soggy lane with hoof 'marks' difficult to struggle through now, a
lovely lane to drive in summer, when dry. Has firm base.
MBB p18. 4x4 mainly summer, horses all year, farmer MORE intensively in
winter.........
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From: Chris Marsden <Byway@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 07:39:48 -0500
Subject: Countryfile
Countryfile, BBC1 Sunday 7/3/99 11.30 - 12.00 (Video + 7668) Covers the
CoCo's RoW21C proposals with tramplers in Winchcombe (or somewhere) "They
can't drive all over here, Disgraceful, they should all be banned, unless I
do it no-one can"
Then they took some shots of unused but usable lanes, obstructed lanes,
farm tracks with a white Disco, Tim talking on a lane that we cleared 3
years ago (Unused in winter) Dead Woman's Lane, and then Harrison in his
house, Brown the obstructor and me at the Upper Lye gate. They took it
several times, "go into more detail without waiting for questions, no not
so long, er could you bring out this point, no we won't be covering that
side of it, oh there was an aircraft, lets do it again", so they can edit
it to make it what they want. Lets hope it is fair, they said it will be,
but lets see. I am not so sure.
cj
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From: Chris Marsden <Byway@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 07:39:48 -0500
Subject: Countryfile
Countryfile, BBC1 Sunday 7/3/99 11.30 - 12.00 (Video + 7668) Covers the
CoCo's RoW21C proposals with tramplers in Winchcombe (or somewhere) "They
can't drive all over here, Disgraceful, they should all be banned, unless I
do it no-one can"
Then they took some shots of unused but usable lanes, obstructed lanes,
farm tracks with a white Disco, Tim talking on a lane that we cleared 3
years ago (Unused in winter) Dead Woman's Lane, and then Harrison in his
house, Brown the obstructor and me at the Upper Lye gate. They took it
several times, "go into more detail without waiting for questions, no not
so long, er could you bring out this point, no we won't be covering that
side of it, oh there was an aircraft, lets do it again", so they can edit
it to make it what they want. Lets hope it is fair, they said it will be,
but lets see. I am not so sure.
cj
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From: Chris Marsden <Byway@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 07:40:36 -0500
Subject: virus
> I recieved the following warning, I do not know wether it is true or a
> hoax.
> Sue
> If you receive an email titled "It Takes Guts to Say 'Jesus'"
> > > DO NOT open it. It will erase everything on your hard drive. Forward
> > > this letter out to as many people as you can. This is a new, very
This is a hoax. It is designed to fill up te Internet with time wasting
mails. Emails do not contain viruses just by reading them, however it IS
possible to have executable files attached to Emails. These CAN contain a
virus. And should NEVER be run UNLESS you know who has sent them.
A similar thing is possible if a document, for example Word (.doc) that can
have very powerful macros incorporated in them, which can start running as
soon as the documnt is open and do things you do not want them to. However
Rich Text Format (.RTF) are safe. They also contain all the basic
information to make documents look like originals, Font type size bold etc.
It also allows document from different versions of Word, Word perfect and
many other packeages to talk to each other.
So may I strongly recommend that it is used if email text is not adequate.
May I also ask that people posting to the list keep emails to a minimum
unless the content is actually adding to RoW, Re-read bfore posting, if it
is not necessary - delete it. I have a number of people unsubscrining
through the volume of emails. I do not want to stop any genuine mails at
all, but too many are silly comments that are not really necessary on a
busy list.
Back to the Virus Sue, (and BTW none of your mesages fall into the former
category), the very next message I got was the following. This had an
attached file which I deleted. It looks a certain virus anyone any ideas?
Sample of file received, claiming to be from HP but clearly is not. Not
the file is not being sent.
______________________________
by arl-img-11.compuserve.com (8.8.6/8.8.6/2.18) with ESMTP id
MAA09323;
Fri, 5 Mar 1999 12:50:18 -0500 (EST)
by mx3.mail.uk.psi.net (8.9.1/) with ESMTP
id RAA13712; Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:48:41 GMT
id <F23WAM3H>; Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:48:09 -0000
Message-ID: <596E9CC19549D211A72900A0C9D16E5E0438F0@mail.tidal.co.uk>
From: Hewlett-Packard <Hewlett-Packard@Tidal.co.uk>
Subject: Stress-Free Storage from Hewlett-Packard
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:47:59 -0000
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0)
[digester: Removing section of: Content-Type: multipart/mixed; ]
[Attachment removed, was 46 lines.]
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From: Chris Marsden <Byway@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 07:40:03 -0500
Subject: Re: Hants - Muddy Lane Hordle
> The Muddy Lane Saga continues....a TRO is threatened, please spend yer
26p
> on a stamp to object, I have submitted the following, but plaese do
change
> the odd word here and there........
Do you have an email or fax no.?
A fax is easier, quicker, more likely to get done, 5p is cheaper than 26p,
and gives me a permanent record of what was said, that it was sent and
when, and that it was recieved.
Most CCs do not log faxes through their mail monitoring system, which is
crazy as the publish it along with their address. But they usually
respond. Don't forget to ask a question so they have to respond, if there
is ANYTHING you need to know.
Chris
MD says:-
1. Since the visibility is ‘very limited in both directions' imposing
a one-way flow would only partly solve the problem in one direction.
Is this one way flow on Muddy Lane? So why not try VR first? that can also
be permanent (by negotiation) just as effective. Is is possible to make the
exit Left turn only to increase safety? What is exit at the other end of
byway like? If slow tractors or HD carriages can emerge, why can't other
vehicles?
Is muddy lane it's name or nature or both? tried digging for a firm surface
below the silt. Many if not most of our lanes have a good surface 3 - 18"
below the crud on top. Think of the Millions of tons of leafmould dropped
into or blown into sunken lanes every year.
2. The banning of four-wheeled traffic altogether would be punitive
and would not ease the potential danger for any other group of users who
would not be affected, eg a farm tractor, a horse and carriage,
motorcyclist, solo horse rider, pedal cyclist, or walker.
3. The cost of administering a TRO would be far more than the
erection of appropriate warning signs on the A337 and another adjacent to
the entrance of Muddy Lane and on the lane itself. I believe that such
warning signs need not be illuminated, but together with appropriate road
paint markings would provide a solution which was at least as effective as
any TRO would be, and far more cost-effective. I would suggest that the
inclusion of a legend such as ‘Sound Horn' be investigated to increase the
effectiveness of any traffic signs considered.
Who should sound horn, vehicles on A337 or Byway? I can't see either would
be very satisfactory, certainly not on A337. It is in a way admitting you
agree there is still a safety problem. No possibility of a 'filter lane'/
verge for a few yards following a left turn?
One way VR would be even cheaper than TRO.
Chris
DT says cutting hedges, if that is all it is, then cut right down to give
good vision, perhaps to 3ft, for just as much as necessary, does s157 HA80
help? MBB, and HAs back to 1835 and earlier I think talk of exclusion of
Sun and Wind etc.
It does make a big difference. No light, no grass/vegetation. Does not
absorb so much moisture, does not bind soil together etc mud/silt
flows/falls back onto carriageway from banks, as well as the drying effect
of both the sun and the wind. Also creates More dappled shade, better than
all shade or all sun for plants and animal life. I know you will say hes
orf 'is rocker again. But just quote MBB p121 chapter and verse to them.
:-Q They may have to change the name of lane though. Dappled shade
Lane. Clearview Lane. Eco Diversity Corridor.
Chris
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From: "Dave Tilbury" <Dave@hants-lanes.demon.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 18:03:41 -0000
Subject: Cross-road
Hi
"There lies through this large parish [Middlesex] the greatest road in
England, and the most frequented, especially by cattle for Smithfield
market; this great road has so many branches, and lies for so long a way
through the parish, and withal has the inconvenience of a clayey ground,
and no gravel at hand, that, modestly speaking, the parish is not able to
keep it in repair; by which means several cross-roads in the parish lie
wholly unpassable, and carts and horses (and men too) have been almost
buried in holes and sloughs; and the main road itself has for many years
lain in a very ordinary condition, which occasioned several motions in
Parliament to raise a toll at Highgate for the performance of what it was
impossible the parish should do, and yet was absolute necessary to be
done."
Carts and horses sunk in a cross-road eh? Serves the buggers right for
riding and driving on a cross-road, which our superior intellect tells us
is only a foot path. Cant scan due to the type face but I'z a typing it
in. It will be available soon. I'm so excited by this little 'gift' I
can't keep it to myself.
Dave Tilbury
Dave@hants-lanes.demon.co.uk
http://www.hants-lanes.demon.co.uk
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From: "Dave Tilbury" <Dave@hants-lanes.demon.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 10:09:05 -0000
Subject: Inspectors
Hi
Did Daniel DeFoe foresee the quality of Inspectors for RoW PIs?
"... always allowing satisfaction to be first made to the owners of such
lands ( .... the value to be adjusted by two indifferent persons to be
named by the Lord Chancellor or Lord Keeper for the time being), and no
water course to be turned from any water-mill ..."
Dave Tilbury
Dave@hants-lanes.demon.co.uk
http://www.hants-lanes.demon.co.uk
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From: "Dave Tilbury" <Dave@hants-lanes.demon.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 18:20:02 -0000
Subject: Re: IT'S WAR!!!!
Hi Davis.
Sound like you would fit in well with our Sunday evening crowd. You admit
no weaknesses!!
Dave Tilbury
Dave@hants-lanes.demon.co.uk
http://www.hants-lanes.demon.co.uk
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From: "Bod" <bod@bod1.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 18:17:50 -0000
Subject: Letter to Trafford
6th March 1999
By Fax To: 0161 912 4407
Dear Mr Rimmer,
I have just returned from a walk in the Carrington area and this included
RUPP 22, Isherwood Road and Ackers Lane. I continued south past the end
of the Definitive RUPP at grid reference SJ 7486 9200 where Ackers Lane
becomes Birch Road to find a new concrete road with small concrete walls on
each side. I walked as far as the point where Birch Road meets
Sinderland Land at SJ 7484 9026.
I was surprised to see that such a concrete road had been constructed and
even more surprised to find a substantial metal gate its the north end.
I am happy to report that the gate was today propped in the open position.
This route is a public highway despite not being included on the Definitive
Map and this is reflected in the signs directing ‘Walkers and Horseriders’
along the route although it is unclear if these signs are directing such
users along the concrete or along the land outside of the walls. I am
assuming that this route is included on the list of streets maintainable at
public expense. Perhaps you could confirm this for me.
There can be little doubt that this route is a public carriageway and there
is powerful documentary evidence to support this view. I am therefore
disappointed that I appear not to have been notified of the development that
has taken place on this route. Can you supply details of any orders
that have been made to authorise diversions (if any) and to authorise the
construction of the concrete walls. You have in the past made
assurances that I would be consulted when any vehicular issues arise and you
reiterated this point in your letter of 10th February 1999 (Ref:
H/SR/JS/50503). With this in mind, can you also please explain why no
consultation or notification was made regarding these developments.
If the above route is not included on the list of streets maintainable at
public expense then would you please supply me with full details of what
your Council would require by way of application for it be added.
Yours faithfully
Ian Boddison
Manchester Area Representative
GLASS (Green Lane Association)
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From: alan kind <alan@highwayman.demon.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 18:25:42 +0000
Subject: Re: Inspectors
In message <bulk.27031.19990306100520@Land-Rover.Team.Net>, Dave Tilbury
<Dave@hants-lanes.demon.co.uk> writes
>Hi
>Did Daniel DeFoe foresee the quality of Inspectors for RoW PIs?
>"... always allowing satisfaction to be first made to the owners of such
>lands ( .... the value to be adjusted by two indifferent persons to be
>named by the Lord Chancellor or Lord Keeper for the time being), and no
[ truncated by list-digester (was 10 lines)]
>named by the Lord Chancellor or Lord Keeper for the time being), and no
>water course to be turned from any water-mill ..."
Fuggin' corker. In a big black box in B&B methinks.
What date was this gem?
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From: alan kind <alan@highwayman.demon.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 18:20:18 +0000
Subject: Re: Cross-road
In message <bulk.27038.19990306100524@Land-Rover.Team.Net>, Dave Tilbury
<Dave@hants-lanes.demon.co.uk> writes
>Hi
>"There lies through this large parish [Middlesex] the greatest road in
>England, and the most frequented, especially by cattle for Smithfield
>market; this great road has so many branches, and lies for so long a way
>through the parish, and withal has the inconvenience of a clayey ground,
>and no gravel at hand, that, modestly speaking, the parish is not able to
[ truncated by list-digester (was 22 lines)]
>in. It will be available soon. I'm so excited by this little 'gift' I
>can't keep it to myself.
You are plainly a Trotskyist anarchist pinko who wants to destroy the
countryside without paying for the priviledge...
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From: "Bod" <bod@bod1.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:05:32 -0000
Subject: Re: Points of law
>>Remember that you do not need to stop for anyone when passing along a
>>highway except a policeman, traffic warden or lollypop lady in
>>uniform [there may be others]. Anyone else can be considered to
>>be a highway robber.
......
>I think the military can be given that right as well, although they don't
>have it all the time.
And the military are usually in uniform.
If they have it sometimes but not others - how is a highway user supposed to
know if they have or have not until they stop???
Cheers,
Bod
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From: "Bod" <bod@bod1.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:17:48 -0000
Subject: Re: Upper Lye
>Ask your kids to set the video for you.
I'll do it myself
Omey-dog is not that clever when it come to technology!
Cheers,
Bod
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From: "Bod" <bod@bod1.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:16:54 -0000
Subject: Walking (was: Re: LoS information within Trafford MBC (was: Re: OS
Explorers (Reply it is not us!! by the HA) - OH YES IT IS))
>>They (Trafford) have regular footpath users meetings but refuse to allow
me
>>to attend despite me asking for an invite. I understand that it is
>>walkers only and that horse rider have also asked and also been refused.
>Can't you walk then Bod ?
Oh yes I can walk alright but as area rep for GLASS (In which capacity I
want to attend the users meetings) I represent the interests of principly
4x4 users with some representation of 2x1 use and a little representation of
carriage drivers.
The fundemental problem is that Trafford believe that vehicles are
undesirable in the countryside and should be confined to the car park at
Dumplington (otherwise known as The Trafford Centre) and the motorways that
lead to it.
Walkers however are not such a sensitive issue and they are quite happy to
talk to the RA, OSS, P&NFPS, Gtr Manchester Pedrestrian Association and
others.
Cheers,
Bod
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From: "Bod" <bod@bod1.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:18:59 -0000
Subject: Re: Explorer 203
>Chris is now on the map
So what is the symbol for a 'Chris' on the explorer series?
I failed to find it in the legend - or is it only on sheet 203?
Cheers,
Bod
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From: doghouse@cix.compulink.co.uk (Michael Dyer)
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 99 22:59 GMT
Subject: Re: Letter to Trafford
Very clever, Ian.........
<<<<<<< of what your Council would require ** by way** of application for
it be added.>>>>>>>>>
73s and 88s
:-) Mick Dyer (doghouse@cix)
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From: doghouse@cix.compulink.co.uk (Michael Dyer)
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 99 22:59 GMT
Subject: Re: Hants - Muddy Lane Hordle
CJM asks
<<<<<<<<,A fax is easier, quicker, more likely to get done, 5p is cheaper
than 26p,and gives me a permanent record of what was said, that it was
sent andwhen, and that it was recieved.>>>>>>>>>
Yes Chris you've said this before but in my case using WinFax screws up my
modem somehow for subsequent EMails :-((((( and I dont think I'm the only
one this happens to....
Anyway fax Number is 01962-841565 FAO Colin Piper
<<<<Is this one way flow on Muddy Lane? So why not try VR first?>>>>
Why should we? We dont use VR on the M25 and thats just as dangerous. HCC
are well prepared to ENFORCE the reinstatement of ML to its published
standard c/w surface traetment so why should we offer more than we need to
resolve the situation?
<<<<that can also
be permanent (by negotiation) just as effective.>>>>
I'd oppose this.
<<<< Is is possible to make the
exit Left turn only to increase safety? What is exit at the other end of
byway like? If slow tractors or HD carriages can emerge, why can't other
vehicles?>>>
We are using the lane on ?Tuesady???so we'll let you know.
<<<<<<<<Who should sound horn, vehicles on A337 or Byway? I can't see
either wouldbe very satisfactory, certainly not on A337. It is in a way
admitting youagree there is still a safety problem.>>>>
There WILL be a safety problem even after the severest-possible trimming
in the view of the PRO-USER HCC RoW Officer I spoke to. Lemme see it for
myself on Tuesday.
73s and 88s
:-) Mick Dyer (doghouse@cix)
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From: doghouse@cix.compulink.co.uk (Michael Dyer)
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 99 22:59 GMT
Subject: Re: Cross-road
<<<<<<You are plainly a Trotskyist anarchist pinko who wants to destroy the
countryside without paying for the priviledge...>>>>>>>>
Alan has obviously met DT before.....
73s and 88s
:-) Mick Dyer (doghouse@cix)
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From: doghouse@cix.compulink.co.uk (Michael Dyer)
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 99 22:59 GMT
Subject: Re: IT'S WAR!!!! (Amended version)
<<<<<<< Damned motor bikes/////////////////Sorry, that doesn't help
either does it? I never did get the hang of sympathy.>>>
David,
I was sorry to hear that you were troubled by the sound of
carelessly-abandoned two-wheel machinery touching your vehicle. I trust
that your concentration on the music coming from stereo was not disturbed
by the tinkling of cheap plastic components rubbing against your bumper.
73s and 88s
:-) Mick Dyer (doghouse@cix)
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From: Chris Marsden <Byway@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:06:22 -0500
Subject: Inspectors
> named by the Lord Chancellor or Lord Keeper for the time being), and no
> water course to be turned from any water-mill ..."
> Dave Tilbury
What does the word turned mean in this context?
As there are private water courses that can be set out, yet I understand
there is a concept that water can not be owned. Any follow-on logic WRT
this?
Chris
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From: Chris Marsden <Byway@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:06:19 -0500
Subject: Copy of: virus
---------- Forwarded Message ----------
From: Chris Marsden, 100620,2156
TO: INTERNET:row@playground.sun.com, INTERNET:row@playground.sun.com
DATE: 06/03/99 00:57
RE: Copy of: virus
The original was truncated (eaten) by the Major for some reason.
Sue,
I was sending an example of a message recieved with a file yesterday, which
I feel is certainly likely to be a virus.
Sample of file received, claiming to be from HP but clearly is not. Not
the file is not being sent.
______________________________
by arl-img-11.compuserve.com (8.8.6/8.8.6/2.18) with ESMTP id
MAA09323;
Fri, 5 Mar 1999 12:50:18 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Stress-Free Storage from Hewlett-Packard
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:47:59 -0000
This is a marketing e-mail campaign from Hewlett-Packard - it was
cleared free of viruses at source* - please click the .exe, sit back and
relax...
Hewlett-Packard Storage Marketing
<<HP1.exe>>
*Hewlett-Packard cannot take responsibility for these files where they
have been stored, opened or retrieved by anyone other than the initial
recipient.
Name: HP1.exe
_____________________________
End of text as received, but note the file HP1.exe HAS NOT BEEN sent to row
the list. If you get anything like this DO NOT OPEN the .exe file. Delete
it immediately, otherwise in months to come, you will not know what it is,
run it to find out, and if it is a virus, it will have done it's worst.
There are some sick people arround, besides gloom and mudpluggers.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
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END OF * LIST DIGEST
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Output: lines 819 [content 679 forwarded 67 (cut 16) whitespace 0]
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