The UK/IERE Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

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From: "Paul Hazell" <p.hazell@worc.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 09:09:13 +0000
Subject:       Re: Speedo - last time honest

David Olley wrote:

>I was on 205 tyres.
>I changed to 750 tyres.
>My speedo now under reads.

You could have said this earlier....

>I would not have expected it differently.
>Sit down with your old maths books and figure it out.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
>original enquiry, which could sort out your common speedo problem. Theory 
>cannot replace the spanner!

Is it just me, or is this getting patronising? I guess I'm just a polite young 
(ish) Series III sod. Maybe its just me, but as a teacher (I've probably made 
loads of enemies now....:-) ) I always thought the idea was to allow the person 
you were explaining the concept to to understand it themselves, as opposed to 
just telling them the way it is and not allow them to question it. What's more, I 
would of thought it was helpful to understand the theory before picking up the 
spanner......;-)

I'll shut up about speedos now........

Paul (SIII Lt/wt 1972)

------------------------------

Date: 14 Mar 96 04:11:21 EST
From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com>
Subject: ARC National Rally

I know this really should be posted to the uk-arc-nr list, but I have doubts
whether anyone is listening in there at all, so I'll give it a shot here...

Is anyone on this list member of, or know anyone at all from Southern ROC,
organizer of this year's ARC National Rally?  Since a month we've been
trying to have the reg.forms sent to us, calling, writing, sent them intl'
postage vouchers to cover the costs, regtr. deadline has meanwhile passed,
but no word from them.  ARC overseas liaison is also pretty much dead,
apart from Geof Miller who does a good job with his 'A.R.C.  News' which he
also keeps on the RRR web page.  Noticed that SROC didn't even send a rep.
to the ARC extr. meeting in December even though the topic was on the
agenda.  What gives?  Fog in the Channel? Is there any way other than
driving over and collecting them personally to get hold of the reg. forms?

Any replies preferably by e-mail or to the uk-arc-nr list, maybe that will
set it going...

Slightly frustrated,

Stefan
<Stefan R. Jacob, 100043.2400@CompuServe.com>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 04:14:54 EST
From: "Steve Reddock" <steve_reddock@uk.xyratex.com>
Subject: Re: IAM

*** Resending note of 03/14/96 00:08
David sed:
|Steve Reddock wrote:
|> I regularly listen to my walkman on the move.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
|> I regularly listen to my walkman on the move.
|Could you please repeat the benefits of IAM membership, Steve.
  
I'll guess this isn't a sarcastic question about "do they give walkman
tape changing lessons without loosing control?" If it is I nearly
spotted it!
  
The IAM teach how to drive in complete control with absolute safety. If
you know exactly where the limits of the current road conditions are you
can drive within them & leave a suitable safety margin.
  
They also teach you to make the most of the available visibility so you
see things before they happen and take the necessary action to prevent
anything unpleasant developing.
  
Face it, Land Rovers do not stop quickly, off road tyres see to that,
so the more anticipation skills you have the better.
  
In doing both of these they make you much less likely to have an
accident, which can only be a good thing. Everything from your health,
stress free lives (if you think you are stressed now wait until you
start arguing with your insurance company!) and your pocket. Accidents
cost loads, your NCD, your excess, all the grief of taxis & trains, the
devaluation your car, etc.
  
Even if you are not at fault it seems never to be worth it even if you
get compensation as well as expenses.
  
You also get cheepie insurance from Turret (but not on modified cars).
Apparently it is significantly cheaper.
  
CONFESSION TIME:  I'm not actually a full member.  My car broke down
towards the end of the test - the clutch stopped releasing fully -
I could barely get it into first/reverse when stopped.  I drove
the rest of the way by double declutching, but I wasn't sufficiently
smooth.  The examiner said that I would have passed it the car hadn't
broken down, but as the test was effectively stopped once my left foot
stopped having much effect.
  
Someday I will get round to taking the test again, but as far as I
am concerned I can (and do) drive to the required standard.  The
examiner made it clear that had the car not given up I would have
passed.
  
You can also join the RAC under the motorsport scheme as the IAM is
an RAC affiliated club and get a considerable discount.  Under this
scheme the RAC will also cover you for breakdown at motorsport events,
even while competing.  So if you roll it on a trial just call them out
and you get free recovery from the stage if necessary.
  
I know a lot of people take offense at any suggestion that their
driving is anything less than perfect, let alone they should take
lessons.  The only response to that is a not too tactful grow up
and put your ego away.
  
The lessons are given by volunteers totally for free - you supply the
car and petrol and they sit beside you and constructively criticise
you.
  
It's got to be worth it hasn't it.
  
JOIN UP!
  
Regards, Steve
  

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 10:09:36 +0000
From: David Olley at New Concept <newconcept@tcp.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Speedo - last time honest

Hi Paul

The trouble with email is that you can't see the smile on the face of 
the writer! Roll on wide band for the future.

This is all done in a friendly way, and I certainly don't intend to 
patronise. We can all learn lots from each other and no one has a 
monopoly on knowledge. I could do with a lot more, for sure.

I don't think any of us who take the time to reply to questions would do 
it if we did not enjoy the exchanges. I think light hearted banter is 
just that, and I am sure you take it that way too.

Best of luck with your s****o.

Cheers

-- 
David Olley
.....................................................................................
Winchester, England
Tel: +44(0)1962-840769      Fax : +44(0)1962-867367
    Home Page:  http://www.tcp.co.uk/~newconcept
.....................................................................................

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 10:12am
From: "David Smith" <DavidS@computing.emap.co.uk>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 05:06:32 EST
From: "Steve Reddock" <steve_reddock@uk.xyratex.com>
Subject: IAM phone number & costs

Hi, forgot the technical details!
  
The phone number is 0181 994 4403.  They will put you in touch with
your local group who arrange all the lessons & stuff.
  
Your local group will charge you 20 quid for associate (learner)
membership.  That entitles you to the lessons, group meetings,
news letters, etc.
  
The combined test and one year full membership costs about 30 quid I
think.
  
Steve Reddock, Xyratex       | Just as he thought he had
Ext.(01705) 486363 x4450     | clinched the interview he was
IBMMAIL (GBXYR96P)           | visited by the ghost of Usenet
Steve_Reddock@uk.xyratex.com | Postings Past.

------------------------------

From: Trefor Delve <delve1t@nectech.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Poor Brakes
Date: Thu, 14 Mar 96 11:16:00 GMT

All,

on this subject, this last weekend I tackled the same problem on my SIII.   
 Here the pedal would take up most of its travel on the first press, BUT   
would be solid.  On the second press, the pedal would hardly move and the   
brakes would be excellent (relatively speaking of course !).

As the pedal was solid on both the first and second presses, I ruled out   
air in the lines as to my mind, this should make the pedal feel spongey.   
 Sure enough, adjusting the brakes up as Ian mentioned so they would just   
move freely cured the problem.  Now the brakes are solid on the first   
press.

Presumably, prior to adjustment, there wasn't enough fluid in the master   
cylinder to take up all of the travel in the shoes in one go.

Regards,

Trefor
tdelve@nectech.co.uk

------------------------------

From: "E D O'BRIEN" <bt5179@qmw.ac.uk>
Date:          Thu, 14 Mar 1996 11:30:10 GMT0BST
Subject:       Re: IAM

> You can also join the RAC under the motorsport scheme as the IAM is
> an RAC affiliated club and get a considerable discount.  Under this
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> even while competing.  So if you roll it on a trial just call them out
> and you get free recovery from the stage if necessary.

> It's got to be worth it hasn't it. >   
> JOIN UP!
> scheme the RAC will also cover you for breakdown at motorsport events,

but how does one actually go about joining and will it help reduce 
insurance premiums?

and is it available to younger drivers?

Ed.O'Brien (SIIA SWB 1963)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 06:17:20 EST
From: "Steve Reddock" <steve_reddock@uk.xyratex.com>
Subject: Re: Speedo - last time honest

*** Resending note of 03/14/96 10:58
WARNING WARNING! AWOOGA AWOOGA!  Do not read this if you have no sense
of humour!!
  
This note is taking the piss.  It is not meant to be serious in
any way :-)))))))))))))))   (mega smiley)
  
Do not reply to this note is was sent from a poster with a disconnected
brain.
  
|The trouble with email is that you can't see the smile on the face of
|the writer! Roll on wide band for the future.

  
What!  David wasn't being patronising?  I was hoping for a low life
student vs scumbag contractors vs perfect permies flame war.
  
Now to stir it up again.  I think students are a waste of tax payers
money and should all be forced to pay for their studies before they
go to university.
  
As for contractors, they should have to pay double tax, not be given
tax dodges.
  
That should increase net traffic...
  

------------------------------

From: "Hazell Paul" <p.hazell@worc.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 12:28:13 +0000
Subject:       Butterfly cakes, oh alright Speedos

David Olley wrote:
> The trouble with email is that you can't see the smile on the face of 
> the writer! Roll on wide band for the future.

No problem  David  - thank God (?) for the 
smiley :-)  Seriously, thanks for the info, very helpful - spanner at the 
ready for the weekend (and bugger the theory ;-) )

Paul (SIII Lt/wt 1972)

------------------------------

From: "Richard Lucking" <BU063@ist2.co.umist.ac.uk>
Date:          Thu, 14 Mar 1996 12:33:54 GB/EIRE
Subject:       Students with landrovers, and joining clubs!

> What!  David wasn't being patronising?  I was hoping for a low life
> student vs scumbag contractors vs perfect permies flame war.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> money and should all be forced to pay for their studies before they
> go to university.

Hmmm, thats what I like to see, blatent stirring!

What am I supposed to think... I cease to be a student in a couple of 
months, and am technically supposed to get a job..... then I suppose 
I have to start hating all students, but then I already hate "Trendy 
green" students.... they don't like nice poluting land rovers :-) so 
I suppose I am half way there already!

LAND ROVER RELATED CONTENT!

Is anyone a menber of a club that has activities in the south of 
england. I would like to join one, and sent of some questions to a 
few, with a stamped envelope, but got standard responses, basicly 
saying join us!

I would like to join a club that has regular meetings in a pub 
somewhere (!) and non competitive off road things.... somewhere in 
the south of england!

Does anyone have any comments... About clubs, not students :-)

Cheers
Richard

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Richard Lucking                      
phone:(0161) 224 6641 (Term)          email:bu063@ist2.co.umist.ac.uk 
                      (Flat 48)     
    Life is a Sexually Transmitted Disease, invariably fatal
Disclaimer: All opinions are my own, or so I've been told....
=====================================================================

------------------------------

From: "Hazell Paul" <p.hazell@worc.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 13:01:23 +0000
Subject:       Students?

Steve Reddock wrote:

> Now to stir it up again.  I think students are a waste of tax payers
> money and should all be forced to pay for their studies before they
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
> As for contractors, they should have to pay double tax, not be given
> tax dodges.
Who said anything about students? Ah, the rich pattern of human 
discourse ;-)

Paul Hazell (SIII Lt/wt)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 08:09:00 EST
From: "Steve Reddock" <steve_reddock@uk.xyratex.com>
Subject: IAM

More clarification:
  
The IAM is a motor club, just a bit different from most. To get in you
have to pass the entrance exam - which is a driving test.
  
Before they let you in the existing members of the group will coach you
on driving so that you can pass the test. At this stage you can have
associate membership.
  
There are no restrictions on entry, but I think you have to have a
fairly clean driving record - no drink driving, etc. The odd speeding
ticket is not a problem.
  
All you have to do technically is borrow a car for long enough to take
the test (1 hour ish) and you can become a full member, regardless of
age, experience or whatever.
  
In practice you need to have a reasonable amount of driving experience.
I am not going to quantify that in terms of years, miles or any other
unit of measure as some drivers pick up more in 10 miles than others do
in 10 years.
  
There are not many who could pass the test without a couple of lessons
(I only had 2 and was at passing standard).
  
You could get details of the cheap insurance deal from the local groups.
I do not have any details anymore. I'm sure you could get a quote to
show what your insurance would be if you passed, with the usual provisos
of the rates increasing etc.
  
The RAC membership thing should come with the joining details of the
club as you usually need to join through the club to be eligible.
  
Regards, Steve
  
Steve Reddock, Xyratex       | Just as he thought he had
Ext.(01705) 486363 x4450     | clinched the interview he was
IBMMAIL (GBXYR96P)           | visited by the ghost of Usenet
Steve_Reddock@uk.xyratex.com | Postings Past.

------------------------------

From: crash@merl.com
Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 11:33:06 -0500
Subject: LR oil pump prime 

I went over the manuals, the print sets, etc. and I think I understand
the problem with the LR oil pump priming now.

It works like this: most conventional engines have a small oil pump
sitting down in the sump.  It's driven (typically) by a thin steel 
driveshaft that's often just a piece of 1/4" steel square rod.  This
works OK- the oil pump is sitting under the oil surface, and hence 
has an excellent chance of pumping *some* oil.

The bad news- that driveshaft is a weak link.  It's usually driven by
fitting into a recess in the bottom of the distributor shaft (which 
"turns the corner" to get rotation down into the sump).  This means 
the shaft is relatively long, and thus rather "springy" - which implies
it will fatigue.

And when you start the engine in *cold* weather, or rev it up high,
you stress that pump shaft.  Eventually it fatigues and then shears,
leaving you with NO oil pumping at all and usually a corpse of an engine
in less than thirty seconds.  To reduce this risk, most manufacturers
fit as small (== low load) oil pump as they can.  Which, unfortunately,
means the engine only gets a marginal amount of lubrication- and probably
only lasts 100Kmiles if it's lucky.

An engine lasting only 100Kmiles?  Clearly NOT what Land Rover would do.... so:

The LR oil pump is radically different.  It's a gear-in-ring pump, and
it's keyed right onto the front of the crankshaft.  The long pump
driveshaft is eliminated entirely.  The pump is *big*- big enough to need
a pressure relief valve; by eliminating the drive shaft we can get a lot
more torque onto the pump without risk of shearing a shaft.  The engine
gets a LOT of oil, and hence lasts a long long time.

The bad news is the pump is now well above oil level.  As the engine gets old
and worn, the pump still has plenty of pressure margin, but it doesn't fit snugly
so if air gets into the pump, the air can circulate rather than being pumped.  

Thus, if you let the pump drain down completely, you may find the old tired 
pump doesn't have enough suction to suck oil up from the sump.  This is bad, 
because no suction means no oil up into the working parts of the engine.

The cure is to drain the sump, refit the plug, add most of the oil, fill the
new filter with oil, remove the old filter, replace the filter.  This means
that the oil pump will never have both the intake (down in the pan) and the
output (up by the filter) open to air at the same time and so oil will NOT
drain out of it and it won't lose it's prime.  [well, actually I'm ignoring
the oil cooler, which sits between the pump and the filter, but that's
just a _long_ pipe.]

That seems to be why the funky six-step oil change procedure exists..

	-Bill

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 09:32:38 +0000
From: Ian Robinson <ian@fourx4.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: G/Box noise identity ????

In message <Chameleon.960312033008.stretch@mypc.vol.net>,
stretch@vol.net writes
>Sorry to jump in with what may be only remotely related, but can 
>anyone comment from experience on the following, which I suspect is 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
>sometimes I can feel it in the gear stick and/or the floor.  
>Clearly, whatever it is has some mass to it (drive shaft or brake).
Check that the handbrake oil seal isn't leaking and or the handbrake
adjusted too tightly *or* a propshaft joint going tight on one or more
lobes. (remove and check for full oscillation)

Regards, Ian
                FOREST LANDROVERS' 4 x 4 CENTRE
                Royal Forest of Dean, Glos, UK
                +44 (0)1594 822606/(0)402 000132
                http://www.star.co.uk/forest

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 20:19:45 +0100
From: lopezba@atnet.at
Subject: Re: Perkins problems...

David Olley wrote:

>Your real car is no doubt a modern lightweight diesel, designed for modern 
city 
>conditions. I don't think the Land Rover lump was envisaged to do such duty. 
>All Series vehicles are inclined to be overcooled, and short runs will not get 
>them up to a decent working temperature. A modern car diesel, on the other 
hand 
>is no doubt designed with a more advanced cooling system which will allow a 
>more rapid warm up.

I wish it was - that is my one and pretty much my only complaint. When I 
arrive at the office, the water temperature gauge is only just starting to 
show signs of life even on a moderately cold day. All right with me - the 
heater in the SI and in the *real* car produce about the same amount of heat 
at that point.

Taxis in Vienna have been Mercedes diesels ever since I got interested in 
cars, which was about 40 years ago. These diesels were not modern 
lightweight ones, but probably comparable to the SI diesel, and they were 
very suitable for the city. Let me stress once more that I have no personal 
experience with SI diesels. I wish Ian Robinson would speak up and hand down 
The Verdict...

>Enjoy the SI.

That is going to be interesting. Driving a more or less unknown SI home for 
a thousand miles or so... I'll let you know if I survive.
Regards
Peter Hirsch
SI 107in S/W
Vienna, Austria (officially 1,000 years old this November 1)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 20:31:35 +0100
From: lopezba@atnet.at
Subject: Eezybleed

Dear all - is Eezybleed still available in the US? In the UK? A friend is 
leaving for the States on Saturday, and she could get it if its not too much 
of a hassle. Any chains? Large shops?

I'll be in the UK in April, so I could get it there if it's still available.

Thanks in advance
Peter Hirsch
SI 107in S/W
Vienna, Austria (officially 1,000 years old this November 1)

------------------------------

From: depuybk@epix.net
Date: Thu, 14 Mar 96 19:57:58 PST
Subject: RE: The Coil Sprung (Land-Rover) Owner List Daily Digest 

>>Bill Adams
>>3Dmentia computer animation
>>4016 Spruell Drive
>>Kensington, MD 20895
>>301-949-9475

>>'66 Land Rover S2A 109" Station Wagon Diesel  ...all there

Bill did not provide an email address so if he has one I would appreciate 
details on above to depuybk@epix.net.

I bought a 92 RR SEL last August and have enjoyed every minute since.  
Having some problems with the sound system but a GREAT HI-WAY Hi-Fi shop 
here in Ithaca and sorting that out.  I owned two S2A 109" wagons while 
overseas and would like to find one for here.  The above has possibilities.

Brad.
------------------------------

Name: Brad DePuy
E-mail: depuybk@epix.net
Date: 3/14/96
Time: 7:57:58 PM

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