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The UK/IERE Land Rover Owner Daily Digest
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From: MRogers315@aol.com
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 04:59:19 EST
Subject: Re-VED (tax!) on fuel
TONY C-H wrote;
> mixers, and other motorised equipment not used on roads may be formed.
A couple of local garages already sell red diesel (which does not carry road
vehicle tax) just for this type of use. So there is no reason why they should
not also sell red petrol (yes it does exist the Lightweight had a couple of
gallons in it that the RAF left there) for use in none road going vehicles and
equipment.
Mike Rogers
Lightweight/Range Rover hybrid
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From: MRogers315@aol.com
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 04:59:20 EST
Subject: Re: LPG (the cheapest)
Hows this for cheap motoring!!
I met a guy at a local gas converters workshop who runs a Range Rover on LPG.
He is currently having a 110 converted from TDI to LPG V8 and is laughing all
the way to the bank. He tells me he runs them on the same gas as his business
central heating system which he buys for just 12p per litre. You apparently
have to justify having a "bottom tapping" from the bulk tank to the
installers. This he does by running a standby generator on the same gas.
Highly illegal I know but how can the authorities tell if road vehicle tax has
been paid on the gas in a vehicle. After all they cannot just dip the tank as
they do to test for red diesel.
Sounds worth the cost of converting the central heating to LPG and installing
a standby generator at home?
Mike Rogers
Lightweight/Range Rover hybrid
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From: MRogers315@aol.com
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 04:59:18 EST
Subject: Re: List topics
>Does anyone actually subscribe to the coilspring list?
>Adrian Redmond
Only owners of Beluga Black Discoveries wanting to know the best place to
mount Bass Boomers or extra switches for unnessisary external lighting.
Mike Rogers
Lightweight/Range Rover hybrid
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From: Gordonkerr@aol.com
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 06:38:40 EST
Subject: Re: Re-VED (tax!) on fuel
In a message dated 23/01/99 10:00:43 GMT Standard Time, MRogers315@aol.com
writes:
> >4. A lobby of people who use fuel for running generators, cement
> > mixers, and other motorised equipment not used on roads may be formed.
> A couple of local garages already sell red diesel (which does not carry
road
> vehicle tax) just for this type of use. So there is no reason why they
> should
> not also sell red petrol (yes it does exist the Lightweight had a couple of
> gallons in it that the RAF left there) for use in none road going vehicles
> and
> equipment.
OK, let them form their lobby, but if the real reason for the extra tax is
pollution caused by internal combustion engines then surely they are also
polluting the atmosphere and so should have to pay! Where the vehicle/engine
is used is surely not relevant as long as then money is used by the government
to tackle pollution - which, of course, it will be won't it?
Gordon
98 Disco Tdi Safari - 87 90 County V8
Bedford
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From: "Rob Smith" <rob@archenland.demon.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 12:11:28 -0000
Subject: RE: Blue tinted bulbs (No LR content)
Danger.
Frank's humour glands are getting better ;-)))
Careful Frank, Old Boy - Spring is only a few short weeks away, all those
short skirts, we don't want a repeat of last year do we?
Rob Smith
Mine's the blue 110
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From: "Rob Smith" <rob@archenland.demon.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 12:11:33 -0000
Subject: RE: List topics
Yes....
And so do a lot of Yanks, a great way to meet some good guys, and play with
their V8 engined babies on holiday ;-)
Rob Smith
Mine's the blue 110
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From: "Rob Smith" <rob@archenland.demon.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 12:15:51 -0000
Subject: RE: car tax/cynical/LPG
Biggest problem with the UK is that there are only about a hundred filling
stations, and most of those are in 'clusters', so the vast majority of the
population are a long way from a source.
I've just been doing the sums on swapping the TD engine in my 110 for an LPG
fuelled V8. On current prices the TD engine costs about 11.5 pence per
mile, and LPG would cost about 10.5. Not much of a saving, but I do about
20,000 mile per year, and the Government has said it will increase the tax
on diesel by inflation +8%, and LPG by inflation +2%, so the difference will
get bigger. My only problem is finding a tank set which will give me the
same range as I am getting at the moment (450 miles per fill)....
On your exhaust valve worries, fit an unleaded head, with the proper harder
guide, valves and seats, and the burn up problem will is apparently cured.
Rob Smith
Mine's the blue 110
p.s. anyone know where I can get a 3.9 EFI engine with all the bits?
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From: doghouse@cix.compulink.co.uk (Michael Dyer)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 99 12:43 GMT0
Subject: Re: LPG (the cheapest)
Mike Rogers asks why we shouldnt all break the law ;-)
<<<<Sounds worth the cost of converting the central heating to LPG and
installinga standby generator at home?>>>
So why go to the expense of converting the house? Just have the tank
installed 'in advance of the work in the house'
...and why install a standby generator? Just rent one for a few days
whilst the tanks being installed.
:-) Mick Dyer (doghouse@cix)
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From: "Michael Wells" <mwells11@rjt.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 12:19:11 -0000
Subject: Question on Vehicle building.
A friend of mine has posed a question which I am sure some-one can answer.
If you buy a range rover remove the body and install a land rover body what
do you register it as. I am aware of the points system but these are for
power train components and chassis but there is nothing for the body. It
cropped up because he is going to buy a 72 rangie and then put a LR body on
it so keeping the tax exempt status.
Thanks. Mick 86" still on the road.
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From: Allan Smith <smitha@candw.lc>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 11:16:34 -0500
Subject: Re: 110 with V8 documentation
Frank grumbled:
>The Lindsay Porter Service Guide covers all engines, but not in any =
>detail, it's just a nice read, no real use.
I disagree. Especially for someone starting out, or where there are no
dealerships or competent garages and you are on your own, this is a very
useful guide to what to keep on top of in day-to-day maintenance. If you're
complaining that it doesn't tell you how to overhaul your engine then you
didn't read the title :-)
Cheers
Allan
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From: Kevan Shaw <ksld@saqnet.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 15:58:39 GMT
Subject: LPG for Oil Burners
There has been a lot about LPG conversions for petrol engines in the press over
the last few months. I have also seen a number of busses and trucks with big
lettering proclaiming that they burn propane. Has anyone heard of conversions
for diesels?
PS for Peter Estiburo why you want V8 after you extoling the virtues of your
wonderfully rebuilt 2.25?
PPS I still have my 2.25 diesel engine left over from my 2.5 TD upgrade. If
someone doesn't buy it soon I'll have to buy another Landie to put it in. . .
Anyone got a spare S1 or S2 ragtop with a blown engine? :-)
PPPPS-
I have just read a report of a speach by Donald Dewar yesterday saying the only
way to reduce car use is to charge tolls starting with M8 this year !! Article
should be on www.scotsman.com.
Personaly I don't think fuel taxing is a good idea. European fue prices are
alredy cheaper than uk so foreign trucks comeinto uk full and frequenly
complete
delivries in England and return without ever buying fuel in uk.
I am very disappointed with the governments transport policies unfortunately I
understand that a certain David Begg an Edinburgh councilor and blight on
trafic
planning is touting his views in thecorridors of power His opinion is that
thecway to reduce traffic is to effecively increase congestion through traffic
calming schemes his only contribution to public transport is the pouring of
gallons of green paint on Edinburghs roads and calling buslanes greenways.
Basicalythe only way to redue traffic congesion and polluion is to provide
integrated rail based publicservice transport with low fares and efficient
vehicles, a high capial cost and revenue support implications maybe but build
thesystems and equipment in the high unemployment areas and save some benefits
or
tax satellite dishes and digial set top boxs but please stop this government
following the last in putting thecart before the horse on transport and
expecting
punitive taxaion and hobelling the existing infrastructure to do anything
useful for the environment.
BTW I runa series three with soft Santana springs. Where do I stand in thesofty
stakes?
Kevan Shaw
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From: Michael Becker <michael.becker@post.rwth-aachen.de>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 17:17:30 +0100
Subject: subscribe
subscribe
subscribe uk landrover owner daily digest
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From: "Mel Mauger & Matthew Reeve" <blatchwood@btinternet.com>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 00:10:30 -0000
Subject: Re: Comments about VED
>>Disabled people and people in remote areas are trickier.
Disabled
>>people should get a rebate. Could this be in the form of
a travel
>>allowance? Perhaps equivalent to the estimated extra fuel
tax per
>>year for an average family car doing average milage. That
would seem
>>fair.
>Perhaps a points scheme, like most supermarkets and some
petrol companies
>use (I've a Fina card) - every time you buy petrol, the
amount is stored on
>the card and can be reclaimed from the government at a
later date.
I like this idea, but how would you stop disreputable people
(of which there are of course none on this list) from
filling up with the disabled points card, then coming home
and siphoning it into someone else's vehicle? I can see how
this could provide a sizable income, maybe this would solve
the problem of disability benefits being a mere pittance?
Not to mention it would be a tax free income....
Matthew
UK, nr Heathrow
1979 2-dr Range Rover 300Tdi
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From: Chris Marsden <Byway@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 14:29:08 -0500
Subject: VED (tax!) on fuel ...
> At 300 pounds per year, ved/gallon= 0.90 pounds
> at 4.54 l/g, this equates to just under 20p/l at the pump.
> Does this sound more terrifying than 300 pounds tax or do people still
> believe this is the best 'incentive to use vehicles less' and collect
> from 'those that still do'?
Am I alone in fearing that an increase of say 20p / l would soon be
accepted as the new hiddeous price and in a couple of years some git would
come up and say, "Oh, lets put the VED up on big engines like Landrovers"
CJ
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From: Chris Marsden <Byway@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 14:29:04 -0500
Subject: Re:Government stupidity
> Here's a suggestion, lets put tax up on ciggarrettes to £20 a packet,
it would clean up the
An interesting thought provoking posting, bet it gets a reply or two! You
are losing sight of the fact that smoking puts more money into the
exchequer than cost of illnesses it causes, and that is why Gov won't tax
it out of existence. Also freedom of rights and smuggling are other
reasons. But I am also against this cancer (sic) in society. Due to
unpleasentness of walking down the street and getting several breaths of
polluted air when passing a smoker, not to mention the health risk stinging
eyes etc in pubs cafes etc, the cost and danger from fires, increased
insurance for all, unsightly cig burns everywhere etc, but smokers have
rights and they can not be taken away, if they know the risks, and *don't*
impose it on others, then I will fight for their rights. Do I suspect you
don't drink either? There are benefits in socialising, stress relief,
chance to talk about Landrovers etc, so long as the duty pays more than the
cost of treatment, people have a right to drink, so long as they don't
impose their violence or accidents on others. If that was banned the
illicit brewing would increase dramatically, prohibition does not work, so
it all comes down to being reasonable and respecting everyone else's rights
and freedoms, to do, or NOT to be forced to do something they don't want.
Is the claim that vehicles take more energy to manufacture than all-life
fuel supportable?
Surely in time the VED and fuel tax will have to harmonize so why put VED
up so dramatically? It will reduce vehicles but tend to increase the use by
those remaining.
Is it the no. of vehicles or the mileage covered or they type of fuel that
is the problem that needs taxing out of existence? So if all cars were
electric or some clean fuel cell, perhaps such that they can not tax the
fuel, (a possible reason?) will they still tax vehicles excessively to save
building new roads?
CJ
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From: Marijn van der Himst <marijn@multiweb.net>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 21:43:56 +0100
Subject: Re: LPG in UK
Thank you, Mick Dyer, Malcolm Woodruff and Leigh Ryder, for your suggestions,
will most certainly check out those url's!
>Where did you get your guide to Europe from and how much did it cost?
-From the ANWB (dutch version of your AA), for DFL 17.50
It's the 1998 edition with 87 LPG-stations listed in England, Wales
and Scotland. Opening hours etc. are in there, as well as other info,
such as "phone first", or "only open for bussiness when somebody is home"..
The publisher is eager to learn if all info is up to date, any first-hand
knowledge of new stations or other deviations are most welcome.
Malcom mentioned "chicken and egg" effect, indeed, if the demand
rises, more stations will have LPG.
According to the guide, in the UK there's been a slight increase last year.
See y'all at Billing and/or Beltring... (any particular type of cd's ?)
Marijn
SIII 109' FFR
Member of EMLRA
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From: "Dave White" <dave@bang.demon.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 22:33:39 -0000
Subject: Re: Question on Vehicle building.
>A friend of mine has posed a question which I am sure some-one can answer.
>If you buy a range rover remove the body and install a land rover body what
>do you register it as. I am aware of the points system but these are for
>power train components and chassis but there is nothing for the body. It
>cropped up because he is going to buy a 72 rangie and then put a LR body on
>it so keeping the tax exempt status.
It is still the same range rover on most hybrid V5's.
Dave White
'82 V8 Stage 1 SW (Light Green)
'69 2.6 LWB 2A (in bits)
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From: "John C. Hinkle" <defender110@email.msn.com>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 16:57:08 -0600
Subject: Question on camouflage colors and patterns
I live in Texas and own a FC 101 GS LHD. The 101 I own has a two color camo
paint scheme, which I assumed was a NATO paint scheme. In researching US
military practices, I find that US military vehicles used a 4 color paint
scheme from late 1974 to 1989, when they changed to a 3 color paint scheme.
The US military also apparently used definite camo patterns for each
specific type of military vehicle. Does anyone on the uk-lro list know if
British or NATO forces had similar practices? Were there specific camoflage
patterns for the lightweight and/or the 101? What colors were standard with
British forces? Thank you.
John Hinkle MD (Chris)
defender110@email.msn.com
http://extremerovers.com
'93 NAS Defender 110 #131
'94 NAS Defender 90 #132
'97 NAS Defender 90 #867
101 Forward Control "Baby"
Lightweight Hybrid Rockcrawler (under construction)
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From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 18:32:13 -0000
Subject: Re: V8 tuners in Hull?
charset="iso-8859-1"
the Hometuner I used to use in Bury when I had my V8 knew his stuff, =
some others don't, it's a case of asking around....
then there's the local racing/rally car tuner (there's one in every =
town), he'll know his stuff...
Best Cheers
Frank
+--+--+--+
I !__| [_]|_\___
I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV
"(o)=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW
------=_NextPart_000_00A4_01BE46FE.B1FDF280
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From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 19:37:54 -0000
Subject: Re: 110 with V8 documentation
charset="iso-8859-1"
>>>>I disagree. Especially for someone starting out, or where there are =
no
dealerships or competent garages and you are on your own, this is a very
useful guide to what to keep on top of in day-to-day maintenance. If =
you're
complaining that it doesn't tell you how to overhaul your engine then =
you
didn't read the title :-)
Cheers
>>>>I disagree. Especially for someone starting out, or where there are =
I was simply answering a specific question regarding overhauling a V8 =
engine. For a beginner wanting service guidance I would recommend the =
book - that just wasn't the question.....
Best Cheers
Frank
+--+--+--+
I !__| [_]|_\___
I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV
"(o)=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW
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From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 19:32:28 -0000
Subject: Re: Blue tinted bulbs (No LR content)
charset="iso-8859-1"
>>>>all those
short skirts, we don't want a repeat of last year do we?
>>>>all those
Rob, If this snow goes away, and my nose stops running, and I get =
feeling back in my fingers, and the short skirts re-appear..... I'll =
take my chances....
Best Cheers
Frank
+--+--+--+
I !__| [_]|_\___
I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV
"(o)=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW
------=_NextPart_000_01E0_01BE4707.1C749C60
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From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 19:01:12 -0000
Subject: Re: Civilised - was List topics
charset="iso-8859-1"
bells and whistles
(ABS etc etc), are just devices
that encourage sloppy driving.
>>>>Without them, you have to drive properly.
With them you can be a sloppy driver, as these "get you out of trouble"
devices, allow you to push your luck further and still be able to get =
out of
the situation!.
In the end its no excuse, and good driving standards are <<<
So, take two otherwise identical cars.
Place one vehicle inside a totally protective cage, place a large petrol =
tank, with a detonator on the front bumper of the other - which one do =
you suppose will be driven more carefully.
Modern bells and whistles encourage dangerous driving, modern =
soundproofing and huge stereos mean that you do not know you are driving =
dangerously.....
the give and take of series v coillers is a good laugh, but people like =
Geoff and I, who drive well maintained 110s are a damn sight closer, in =
noise and rattle levels, to a series, than to a modern BMW.
And just guess which vehicle, Ser, 110 or BMW is, in generally driven in =
the more dangerous fashion?
Best Cheers
Frank
+--+--+--+
I !__| [_]|_\___
I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV
"(o)=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW
------=_NextPart_000_013F_01BE4702.BEC76D80
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From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1999 00:45:18 -0000
Subject: Re: Question on camouflage colors and patterns
charset="iso-8859-1"
Chris,
ISTR reading that different regiments had different camo patterns...
I have forwarded yr message to a friend on the Uk-list who is editor of =
the Military Land Rovers Club magazine - if he doesn't know he will know =
someone who does!
Best Cheers
Frank
+--+--+--+
I !__| [_]|_\___
I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV
"(o)=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW
------=_NextPart_000_0036_01BE4732.D0B7DCC0
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From: "John C. Hinkle" <defender110@email.msn.com>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 20:44:20 -0600
Subject: Re: Question on camouflage colors and patterns
Frank-
Thank you.
Chris Hinkle
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From: Allan Smith <smitha@candw.lc>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 22:59:56 -0500
Subject: Re: 110 with V8 documentation
At 19:37 23/01/99 +0000, Frank wrote:
>I was simply answering a specific question regarding overhauling a V8 =
>engine. For a beginner wanting service guidance I would recommend the =
>book - that just wasn't the question.....
Exactly - servicing wasn't the question so there was no need to introduce
an inappropriate book and then dis it. Beginners on the list may have
misconstrued "no real use' as being a recommendation.
OK - next round is on me, what are you having?.
Allan
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